Citra rhizomes

[Andy_C]

Hi All
A good friend of mine has offered to donate some space on his allotment. No doubt he will be rewarded in full with beer
Ideally I would like to grow some Citra. Has anyone here in the UK managed to get hold of any Citra plants. Would you be willing to share some rhizomes to get me started ?
PM please if you can help.
Thanks in adavnce
Andy

[Fil]

good luck.. and pop me next on the list if you find any, but at the moment i think your only option is to find a viable seed in a vacpac of hops and grow to see if it is citra enough cos its highly unlikely it will be a like for like due to the unknown pollen source

[Andy_C]

I know, but I trust the members of Jims Beer Kit forum will come up trumps. If not I may be scratching round the bottom of empty vacumn seal packets looking for seeds that may never germinate. Will give it a go though.

Cheers

Andy

[Andy_C]

Has anyone had experience of this seller on ebay

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CITRA-hops-ho ... 19f3861224

Would be good if genuine citra seeds but weather or not a good seller ?

[Charles1968]

Citra is a proprietary hop variety, which means you need a license to grow it and cannot sell rhizomes or seeds (and in any case, you can't propagate specific hop varieties by seed as the parent plant will have been pollinated by another variety). I would guess the enterprising seller on eBay offering what looks like almost every known hop variety at over 50 cents a seed (and the seeds are tiny) actually only has one variety. If you want to double check, email and ask if he/she has riwaka. If he says yes, he's definitely a crook.

[scuppeteer]

If you want to double check, email and ask if he/she has riwaka. If he says yes, he's definitely a crook.

Why would that be? I got hold of some a couple of months ago. Its a case of knowing the right people! I'm not likely to get anymore mind you, but I'll certainly be having a go at the seed in the Spring.

[Andy_C]

So Dave I wish you every success in growing your citra hops from seed. When your plot gets overgrow with hop plants and you have to start digging up some roots. Please consider me as someone who would take care of them (pretty please) lol

[scuppeteer]

A good friend of mine has offered to donate some space on his allotment.

Your friends offer is very kind but I would check the position of the plot in regards to the other allotment holders. I'm fairly sure they would be none too pleased when their prize veg is permanently shaded by a 12ft hopbine!

[keith1664]

A good friend of mine has offered to donate some space on his allotment.

Your friends offer is very kind but I would check the position of the plot in regards to the other allotment holders. I'm fairly sure they would be none too pleased when their prize veg is permanently shaded by a 12ft hopbine!

12ft... a dwarf variety is it?

[scuppeteer]

Charles1968. The hop rhizome is a propriety variety only, not the seed. You cannot sell or grow the plant without permission but as you say the seed will not grow true to the mother plant, so in effect by growing a seedling you have a new variety which does not fall under the licensing.

[scuppeteer]

A good friend of mine has offered to donate some space on his allotment.

Your friends offer is very kind but I would check the position of the plot in regards to the other allotment holders. I'm fairly sure they would be none too pleased when their prize veg is permanently shaded by a 12ft hopbine!

12ft... a dwarf variety is it?

I was under the assumption that no-one would put up 18ft poles on an allotment and expect them to not fall over!

[Charles1968]

If it doesn't grow true, it won't be Citra. Seeds from pollinated cones will have lost half the genome.

[Charles1968]

The fact that the seller is marketing seeds that cannot be true to variety should make you question how honest they are. I guess it's possible they've bought hops from many different sources and combed through them for seeds. They almost certainly won't have riwaka though - always sells out in an instant at harvest and isn't grown outside NZ. I bet the seller will offer riwaka when queried though.

[Mr. Dripping]

good luck.. and pop me next on the list if you find any, but at the moment i think your only option is to find a viable seed in a vacpac of hops and grow to see if it is citra enough cos its highly unlikely it will be a like for like due to the unknown pollen source

The pollen source is certainly unknown if you do find a seed, but I would still say the seed is worth growing.
I guess the farmers are doing all they can to prevent pollination, and it is fairly likely that any seed is the result of self pollination - a hermaphrodite plant will produce pollen in a desperate attempt of self preservation. Such seeds will always result in female plants that have 100% Citra genetics, but may show very different growth characteristics.
If the pollen was from an outside source, I'd still grow the seed.....you've got 50% of the genetic material from Citra, and could end up with an interesting cultivar.....though you do have a roughly equal chance of getting a male plant.

[seymour]

Charles1968. The hop rhizome is a propriety variety only, not the seed. You cannot sell or grow the plant without permission but as you say the seed will not grow true to the mother plant, so in effect by growing a seedling you have a new variety which does not fall under the licensing.

Scuppeteer's the man. He's right as always.

That said, when it comes to these ultra-protective proprietary types, you can sometimes get some "reverse engineering" clues from their own patent records. Citra is the trademark for HBC394, which is thoroughly explained in public records: http://www.google.com/patents/USPP21289

I'm not saying you can recreate their elaborate hybrid event, but at least now we know Citra should produce natural fertile seeds (though only containing half Citra genes, half from whichever male open pollinated it, as previously stated.) The problem with so many other trendy new hops is they were created through triploid gene splices, rendering them sterile.

Who would've guessed Citra came from two Hallertauer mittlefrueh derived parents?!