Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

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tazuk

Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by tazuk » Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:36 am

sweet cheers i must have about 4 brews planed for the next few week lol 2 of them yours lol this one and the ameerian amber ale :D :D
i also have some vanilla pods in kitchen cupboard may add some mmmmmmm
seymour wrote:
tazuk wrote:re Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout the amount of 454 g, Lactose, in boil?
I did. I bought a 1 pound bag and used the whole thing. If you're afraid of it coming out too sweet, feel free to reduce it to 3/4 lb (340 g). Or use a more attenuative yeast. The high dose of lactose combined with Windsor yeast as I did (already renowned for leaving behind residual malt sweetness), mine is definitely on the sweet end of the Sweet Stout spectrum. But as I said, given enough patience, it turned out surprisingly delicious. I don't have to tell you chocolate flavors go good with milk flavors. Good luck, and keep us updated if you give it a go.
barney wrote:Good Luck in the competition Seymour!
Thanks, man! Hoping for the best!

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jmc
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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by jmc » Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:16 pm

seymour wrote:Woah, great post! Keep us posted on how it ends up tasting.
After 2 weeks in spare bucket at around 23C, I transfered Lambic Sour Stout to 3 plastic DJs (old Ashbeck spring water bottles).
Lots of lambic activity on surface when I transferred. It had got down to 1006.
Image
Image

Above picture was from a week ago. DJs all now have bug layer on surface.
Not sure how long to leave it in DJs before bottling but my try to leave at least 1 leave until after summer.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by jmc » Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:03 am

Seymour - how long did you leave the sour batch before bottling?
Cheers John

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by Jocky » Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:47 am

I love this thread. Mainly because I clicked into it expecting some interesting musings on a sweet stout ... ANDTHENHESDOINGWHATWITHTHEGRAIN?

Very inspiring stuff.

I think it's fair to say that British drinkers are really only just starting to get a taste for hops in beer, most pubs tout the fact that they sell 'real ale' but it's actually a fairly plain, boring brown beer.
Ingredients: Water, Barley, Hops, Yeast, Seaweed, Blood, Sweat, The swim bladder of a sturgeon, My enemies tears, Scenes of mild peril, An otter's handbag and Riboflavin.

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seymour
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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Fri Feb 01, 2013 3:55 pm

jmc wrote:Seymour - how long did you leave the sour batch before bottling?
It always varies, some sour beers (particularly lambics which contain brett, and again for the record: this one did not, so it's not a lambic) should be left to bulk age for a year or more. This one was fermented mainly with Duvel yeast and lactobacterial cultures, both of which finish quickly. I didn't even bother to rack to a secondary fermentor, but bottled it at five weeks because it had already achieved 98% attenuation.

Guys, this stuff is drinking crazy delicious. It's like a high-grav Kvass, or a chocolately Berliner Weiss, if you can imagine such a thing. It's sweet and sour, toasty, tangy and tart, spritzy, with complex aromas and some alcoholic kick. Some people have compared it to Dr. Pepper soda, which I hadn't thought of, have never tasted in a beer, but it's true. Really unusual.

Oh, sorry. Short answer: 5 weeks.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by Jocky » Fri Feb 01, 2013 4:14 pm

What was with the idea of throwing in about 5 different types of yeast? Just to ferment it and see what happens, and then potentially harvest the yeast if it's good?
Ingredients: Water, Barley, Hops, Yeast, Seaweed, Blood, Sweat, The swim bladder of a sturgeon, My enemies tears, Scenes of mild peril, An otter's handbag and Riboflavin.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Fri Feb 01, 2013 4:50 pm

Jocky wrote:What was with the idea of throwing in about 5 different types of yeast? Just to ferment it and see what happens, and then potentially harvest the yeast if it's good?
Yeah, basically. I normally just dump my spent grains on the compost pile, so it cost nothing to try something fun. Plus, if it works, I've built up and reinvigorated my sour blend. By "5 yeasts", I assume you're referring to:
seymour wrote:Finally--and this is the really crazy part--I pitched dregs from a mate's delicious wild fermented beer, plus dregs from my seriously sour Imperial Berliner Weiss, plus a wild yeast I cultured from Bulgarian juniper berries, plus a small Duvel bottle culture. It's a whole zoo of microorganisms, but I'm very excited to taste this experiment in a month or so.
Technically, I'm sure there are many more than five yeast strains, plus Lactobacillus bulgaricus, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Lactobacillus bifidus, and many others which aren't exactly yeast at all.

Okay, only because you asked, my thinking was basically along these lines:

Duvel yeast for the heavy lifting, because it's a Belgian powerhouse, and I wanted mine to have some regular beer flavours.

Dregs from my Berliner Weiss because it was insanely delicious, can't go wrong pitching it again.

Dregs from my mate's wild fermented beer because I loved it and wanted to recreate something along those lines. His was browner and maltier than any other sour I'd tasted, so I wanted to ensure I had something capable of that in my own blend (incidentally I gave him back a six pack of my own Chocolate Sour plus a jar of the newly blended dregs. He's planning to use it on a Saison with NZ Rakau hops. Mmmmm.)

Dregs I cultured from Bulgarian juniper berries because (as I've said) that part of the world is the possible earliest origin of most familiar fermenting strains used for yogurt, kvass, cheese, pickled vegetables, etc, and for the same reasons, the native people groups who consume them are among the healthiest and longest-lived in the world (this is obviously an area of interest for me as a brewer and as a human, even modern doctors understand that death usually starts in the colon, assist your body's ability to digest stuff, you'll unburden your immune system and stave off the starting points of much disease and decay, I could go on and on...) Plus, I tasted it to be sure, it didn't suck, so I couldn't resist.

This time everything came together and worked, against all odds, so it lives to fight another day... I'll just keep compounding this bad boy until it sucks.

Short answer: Single-strain fermentation is boring and overrated.
Last edited by seymour on Fri Feb 01, 2013 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

barney

Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by barney » Fri Feb 01, 2013 6:14 pm

Seymour, Try the Kefir for the colon and intestine. wonderful slightly sour tang and ten times the flora than the regular yogurty stuff.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Fri Feb 01, 2013 6:43 pm

Yeah, I love it too. I've also recently discovered Kombucha. Getchasome! I developed my own "mother" or "scoby" (Symbiotic Culture Of Bacteria and Yeast, yeah I know it's dorky) from the dregs of a store-bought bottle, and I'm on my third tiny batch. I keep meaning to write a post about it.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by Jocky » Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:19 pm

Seymour, I've been trying to get my head around the bacterial side of fermentation. Do you think that the bacteria have actually done much fermenting, or are they just adding a slight sourness right now?

I know that traditional lambics can take a couple of years to mature to the point that they are actually drinkable and don't smell like dead horse (or so I'm told). Are you expecting your brew to go through that stage, or do you think it's done?
Ingredients: Water, Barley, Hops, Yeast, Seaweed, Blood, Sweat, The swim bladder of a sturgeon, My enemies tears, Scenes of mild peril, An otter's handbag and Riboflavin.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:37 pm

Jocky wrote:Seymour, I've been trying to get my head around the bacterial side of fermentation. Do you think that the bacteria have actually done much fermenting, or are they just adding a slight sourness right now?

I know that traditional lambics can take a couple of years to mature to the point that they are actually drinkable and don't smell like dead horse (or so I'm told). Are you expecting your brew to go through that stage, or do you think it's done?
Thanks for all your interest, Jocky. Oh yeah, lacto bacteria is definitely a fermentation agent. Same used for yoghurt, sauerkraut, kim chee, kvass, some vinegars and pickles, etc. It produces more acid in the process compared to brewers yeasts, hence the sourness. Ale and lager yeasts are the fermentation agents we brewers most often use, but there are many others in nature. Take a look at a yeast archive website sometime (ATCC, VLB, NCYC, etc.) The ATCC alone has 18,000 bacteria and phage strains and 32,000 yeast and fungi strains.

I keep saying it, but mine isn't a lambic. Lambics contain brett (among other stuff, I know), which wild seeming as it is, is a true yeast (and--ironically--was originally isolated as a "spoiling agent" of English ale, but I digress.) This is also a digression, but I don't even think brett tastes sour. Brett tastes earthy, musty, over-ripe, composty, even as you say "horse-y" or "barnyard-y", very unlike a mellow ale or neutral lager, but not sour, exactly. Again, true sourness typically comes from lactic acid forming lactobacillus, which is not yeast, and is definitely not brett yeast.

Mine (as far as I know) does not contain any brett yeast. I'm certain it will continue evolving and changing, I'll hold back some bottles to taste in distant months/years, but it never developed a lambic pellicle, and I don't expect it to become lambic-y, per se. It seems many people have the misconception that all sour beer = lambic. I partially blame the BJCP for lumping all sour and wild beer together. There are many types of sour beers which are unlike lambic: Berliner Weiss, Flanders Red, Flanders Brune, even your own English Olde Ale, among others.
Last edited by seymour on Sat May 04, 2013 4:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

barney

Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by barney » Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:56 pm

seymour wrote:Yeah, I love it too. I've also recently discovered Kombucha. Getchasome! I developed my own "mother" or "scoby" (Symbiotic Culture Of Bacteria and Yeast, yeah I know it's dorky) from the dregs of a store-bought bottle, and I'm on my third tiny batch. I keep meaning to write a post about it.
I have a scoby in the fridge, not brewed with it yet though. :)

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Fri Feb 01, 2013 9:01 pm

barney wrote:I have a scoby in the fridge, not brewed with it yet though. :)
YEAH!!! Go, Barney! It's so much simpler than homebrewing beer, it only takes minutes. Really.

Hint, hint:
mixing-in some Earl Grey along with the prescribed Green Tea lends a nice citrusy/resiny aroma, and mixing-in some brown sugar with the prescribed white sugar lends a nice Faro Lambic richness. This stuff is gonna catch-on like wildfire, I know it.
Last edited by seymour on Fri Feb 01, 2013 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

barney

Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by barney » Fri Feb 01, 2013 9:05 pm

I read that its the original fermenting agent for true ginger beer. :)

I will try the earl grey and brown sugar it sounds fabulous.

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Re: Seymour Chocolate Milk Stout

Post by seymour » Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:53 pm

barney wrote:I read that its the original fermenting agent for true ginger beer. :)
Fascinating. I hadn't heard that, but it makes sense.

I tasted a new type of kombucha yesterday with pureed raspberries, lemon juice, and ginger. It was my favorite of all so far.
Last edited by seymour on Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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