First mini-mash (in a bag)

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StuAlban

First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by StuAlban » Sun Dec 14, 2014 5:57 pm

I finally stepped up to some proper mashing on my last brew after 2-3 years of kits followed by partial extract brewing. I thought I would post my experiences and observations here and welcome any comments. Can't say I followed a particular recipe or method just decided to give it a try and hope to learn something for next time.

Recipe:
1kg Maris Otter Pale Malt
500g Crushed Pale Malt (Young's)
250g Cara Red 50 EBC
250g Crystal 135 EBC
1kg Medium Spraymalt
30g Cascade @ 60 mins
15g Saaz and 15g Hallertauer Hersbrucker @ 5 mins
200g Malto Dextrin
200g Lactose
Windsor Yeast

Method:
9 litres of water in a 13.5 litre stockpot @ 72C (on the hob).

Mash the malts in a bag* for 75 mins, aiming for 67C throughout. By putting the lid on the stockpot and taping over the small hole in it, I managed to keep a fairly constant temperature. When I did need to put the gas back on a low setting to raise the temperature I found that I overshot the temperature a couple of times. Range of temperature was 65-72C.
*used a 'Ritchies Mashing and Sparging Bag' which is apparently designed for a 'Bruheat Brewers boiler' but it working well in this pot.

Lift the bag out and sparged with 4 litres of 50C water.

Ended up with a pre-boil gravity of 1042. Not sure what kind of efficiency I got or how to measure it.

Boil for 60 minutes adding hops as required.

Flame out, remove hop bags (all leaf hops). Didn't measure the post-boil volume but guess it was approx 9 litres.

Dissolved DME, Malto Dextrin and Lactose. (Only used the latter as had some left over from previous brews). Gravity was 1102 at this stage.

Cooled the pot in sink of cold water (3 times) to reduce temperature to 33C.

Added to fermenter and topped up with cold water to 15 litres. Gravity of 1060. Temperature of 24C.

Pitched Windsor yeast (dry).

Results (so far):
Fermenting for 12 days without any temperature control. Decent amount of yeast/foam layer after 2 days but it didn't go mad.
Gravity now down to 1027 so not ready yet. Am slightly worried as I always ferment batches for 14 days and check on day 12 if it is making good progress. Never had such a high gravity as this after 12 days before.

Have decide to leave it another 7 days (till next weeked) and hope that it is still fermenting and will get down below 1020.

Overall enjoyed the process of mashing some grains and just hope this will ferment out to give me a drinkable beer.

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orlando
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Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by orlando » Sun Dec 14, 2014 6:22 pm

First thing to say is good for you, taking the first step is the most important, though it is a slippery slope and someone in your life might regret it. :lol:

I have not done a BIAB so others will come along with more hints and tips but a couple of observations may help towards next time.

You might try something like an old sleeping bag or duvet to keep the heat in the mash, if you don't, adding heat, unless carefully controlled, can easily denature the enzymes in the mash and stop them converting the starches into sugar. Sparging at 50c is a little low you should be closer to 75 to 80 that low is not going to wash out the remaining sugars as the higher temperature. Efficiency is a measure of how many gravity points you got from the mash per litre of liquour, not something to worry about at the moment. The concern is where you are with fermentation. 24c is a little high to pitch at, it's better to start low and allow the temperature to rise, 18-20 is what I would shoot for. With such a high starting gravity it will finish fairly high but the main reason is going to be your addition of Lactose. Lactose is not a fermentable sugar for beer yeast, it is often used in something like a milk Stout where you are after some residual sweetness. I would check your gravity every day from now, careful with sanitation don't put the sample back. Once you have a minimum of 3 days the same it is fermented out and you can consider packaging. There is a a good BIAB community on here so no doubt others will add some really good advice to this and make sure your next batch is even better. Good luck.
I am "The Little Red Brooster"

Fermenting:
Conditioning:
Drinking: Southwold Again,

Up Next: John Barleycorn (Barley Wine)
Planning: Winter drinking Beer

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Jocky
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Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by Jocky » Mon Dec 15, 2014 11:24 am

Good luck, if you've decided to step up from your kits/extract then I'm guessing you felt you were missing something from your beer. I can guarantee that if that's the case then mashing makes a world of difference, although it also puts you on a slippery slope to all grain.

Regarding technique/feedback... I'd go with what orlando said really - you'll refine what you do for the mash to keep temperature stable as you get more practice. It's definitely worth using a strike water temperature calculator to work out what temperature you want to have your strike water to hit your mash temperature. Equally you'll want to keep some of your own notes about it (dry grain temperature, strike water temperature, resulting mash temperature, and weight of grain/volume of water) to help dial that right in.

I recently bought a 13.5 tog winter duvet from Sainsburys for £6 - something like this will minimise your temperature losses.

Equally don't worry about a bit of temperature variation this time, it'll turn out just fine. The only thing I'll add is that if you haven't used it before, lactose can tend to confuse gravity readings, and Windsor tends to leave a lot of sugars behind, so if you find your gravity rather high you might need to make a little extract starter of US-05 or Nottingham and then throw that in to help munch as many sugars as possible.
Ingredients: Water, Barley, Hops, Yeast, Seaweed, Blood, Sweat, The swim bladder of a sturgeon, My enemies tears, Scenes of mild peril, An otter's handbag and Riboflavin.

StuAlban

Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by StuAlban » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:19 pm

Thanks orlando and jocky for the advice. I'll take that on board for next time. I've used lactose before (for a sweet extract stout) but probably shouldn't have confused this brew with it!

It is still at 1027 on day 16 so I guess I need to pitch some more yeast. I've got some S-04 and Nottingham in the fridge. Not having done a proper starter before could I get away with just rehydrating it or even pitching it dry?

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orlando
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Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by orlando » Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:58 am

You can try but you have two potential problems. First. the original yeast will have used most if not all of the available oxygen so a dried yeast will have to rely on its own reserves, don't try to aerate. Secondly, if the original yeast has used up all the fermentable sugar it may not go down any further. Using a dried yeast is your best hope and it is inexpensive so worth it just for the experiment, if nothing else it will give you an anecdote to tell when this comes up again in the future - it will :wink: .
I am "The Little Red Brooster"

Fermenting:
Conditioning:
Drinking: Southwold Again,

Up Next: John Barleycorn (Barley Wine)
Planning: Winter drinking Beer

StuAlban

Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by StuAlban » Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:08 pm

A belated update on this brew and thanks to orlando and jocky for the advice. I added some S-04 on day 17 of this brew but it didn't seem to do anything. Bottled it anyway on day 20 at 1027. After some conditioning in the bottle it turned out a nice beer, if a little over-sweet. Could certainly tell a difference to my previous extract brews as it had more body and a deeper flavour. Have subsequently done a second mini-mash incorporating the advice above and that's ready to bottle tomorrow.

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orlando
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Re: First mini-mash (in a bag)

Post by orlando » Sun Mar 08, 2015 8:22 am

StuAlban wrote:A belated update on this brew and thanks to orlando and jocky for the advice. I added some S-04 on day 17 of this brew but it didn't seem to do anything. Bottled it anyway on day 20 at 1027. After some conditioning in the bottle it turned out a nice beer, if a little over-sweet. Could certainly tell a difference to my previous extract brews as it had more body and a deeper flavour. Have subsequently done a second mini-mash incorporating the advice above and that's ready to bottle tomorrow.
Well like I said, you now have an anecdote for the future. unfortunate it finished so high but hopefully you are now more informed to avoid next time.
I am "The Little Red Brooster"

Fermenting:
Conditioning:
Drinking: Southwold Again,

Up Next: John Barleycorn (Barley Wine)
Planning: Winter drinking Beer

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