bottles clouding on opening

[geraintashley1971]

I've ditched my barrels in favour of bottles as they are more easily transported around the house.
Anyhow, the last two attempts have been a bit of a pain because the beer clouds up when i open the bottles. The action of opening the pressurised bottle stirs up the sediment and turns a perfectly clear ale into ditch water.
Can anyone advise where I'm going wrong?
I think it may be down to one or more of the following:
A) I'm not letting the initial fermentation go on long enough so in the bottles I'm getting too vigorous a secondary fermentation;
B) I'm not moving the bottles to a cold enough area once secondary fermentation is complete so the yeast never really calms down;
C) I'm using too much sugar for secondary fermentation (although the last time I decanted the brew and added the supplied sugar to the decanted batch prior to bottling)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

[Mr Squiffy]

Not B, I never really cold crash and don't have that problem. Could be both A & C though. Some yeasts are more easily disturbed than others but the disturbance is usually caused by the CO2 released on opening. Do they open with quite a big release of gas?
I usually batch prime with 80-100g of sugar to 5gallons, how does that compare with you?

[Jocky]

It would help to know how soon you are bottling, and also how soon after bottling you are trying the beer.

The main things to look at are:

Avoiding getting too much yeast into the bottle - this is the big one;
Making sure you're not overpriming your bottles;
Ensuring the beer has enough time to condition in the bottle.

In terms of the first item, you're right in that you need to be careful how soon you bottle. A couple of weeks in the fermenter should help the majority of yeast drop out, three weeks is even better, just keep that fermenter sealed up tight after the krausen on the yeast subsides.

When it comes to bottling, rack the beer from the top of the liquid to avoid sucking up the yeast at the bottom. When you get near the end of the beer don't be greedy and suck up every last drop, as you'll be pulling up loads of yeast with it, leave some beer behind - it'll save more in the long run.

Your priming amount sounds fine, I think that just after bottling you need to leave your bottles at least 3 weeks undisturbed and again, longer is better. The longer you leave it the more the sediment will pack down. Chilling the bottles speeds this up even further.

Finally, if all else fails it helps to serve bottles cold - from the fridge. It leaves the CO2 more dissolved in the liquid until it gets knocked out by pouring.

Enjoy!

[oldbloke]

Also, what yeast are you using? Some are better at sticking to the bottom of the bottle than others.

[IPA]

The simple answer is that there is too much yeast in the bottle and it is over carbonated. If you want to know how to correct this post your brewing procedure and I can give you some advice.

[geraintashley1971]

[quote="Mr Squiffy"]Not B, I never really cold crash and don't have that problem. Could be both A & C though. Some yeasts are more easily disturbed than others but the disturbance is usually caused by the CO2 released on opening. Do they open with quite a big release of gas?
I usually batch prime with 80-100g of sugar to 5gallons, how does that compare with you?[/quote]
Yeah, there is quite a rush of gas. I've even tried releasing some and then resealing.
The quantity of sugar is the same as you only, with most kits I use granulated sugar for secondary fermentation but the LoveBrewing kits come with priming sugar and I batch prime so the ratio should be spot on.

[geraintashley1971]

[quote="Jocky"]It would help to know how soon you are bottling, and also how soon after bottling you are trying the beer.

The main things to look at are:

Avoiding getting too much yeast into the bottle - this is the big one;
Making sure you're not overpriming your bottles;
Ensuring the beer has enough time to condition in the bottle.

In terms of the first item, you're right in that you need to be careful how soon you bottle. A couple of weeks in the fermenter should help the majority of yeast drop out, three weeks is even better, just keep that fermenter sealed up tight after the krausen on the yeast subsides.

When it comes to bottling, rack the beer from the top of the liquid to avoid sucking up the yeast at the bottom. When you get near the end of the beer don't be greedy and suck up every last drop, as you'll be pulling up loads of yeast with it, leave some beer behind - it'll save more in the long run.

Your priming amount sounds fine, I think that just after bottling you need to leave your bottles at least 3 weeks undisturbed and again, longer is better. The longer you leave it the more the sediment will pack down. Chilling the bottles speeds this up even further.

Finally, if all else fails it helps to serve bottles cold - from the fridge. It leaves the CO2 more dissolved in the liquid until it gets knocked out by pouring.

Enjoy![/quote]

Great advice: I've been siphoning from the bottom and not leaving it long enough at any stage. I've followed the instructions to the letter but have always suspected that where I live is a couple of degrees cooler so I should allowing extra time.

[orlando]

Take a look at a bottle conditioned beer in a Supermarket, you will be hard pressed to even see the "coat of paint" layer of yeast it contains. A good start for reducing yeast levels in the bottled beer is to cold chill the beer in the fermentor before racking off to your bottling bucket. If the beer isn't crystal clear at this stage consider fining with gelatine. A very careful stirring in of your priming solution should see you home. By the way, crystal clear beer at this stage is something of a misnomer, there will still be millions of cells left to condition the beer.

[scotsloon]

I've followed the instructions to the letter

This might be where your process is falling down. If you are brewing kit beers and following the instructions that came with the kit. DON'T! These instructions are generally less than useful. To ensure that your beer has finished fermenting you need to check the SG over the period of a few days, if the SG remains the same then the beer is ready for bottling. This advice applies to both kit and AG brewing. Also getting into the habit of leaving the beer for up to 3 weeks in the fermenter before interfering with it is good advice. Often the problem with this kind of issue comes down to patience and developing a more couldn't care less attitude.

[Mr Squiffy]

I've followed the instructions to the letter

......getting into the habit of leaving the beer for up to 3 weeks in the fermenter before interfering with it is good advice. Often the problem with this kind of issue comes down to patience and developing a more couldn't care less attitude.

Yep, patience. In my early brewing days my hoppy pale ales were carbonated perfectly but my dark malty beers tended to get more and more gassy with time. The difference was dry hopping, my dry-hopped beers had to be left for at least 3 weeks before bottling to allow the dry-hop to do its stuff, my dark malty beers weren't dry-hopped and were bottled after about 2 weeks, probably too early before fermentation had properly finished. I have had the odd bottle bomb, but never from a dry-hopped beer.

[Redimpz]

Something that I have noticed is that Kits often take longer than AG to ferment out. well, they do in my house anyway.

[mickhew]

If this happens again let us know what kit it is, and how much priming sugar you're using. I've done loads of kits in bottles, and never had a problem. 85gm sugar for ale, around 170gm for lagers. Sounds like you may be bottling too early. Have you got a hydrometer?