Strong American Porter

[Laripu]

Today I'm making UK Wolf, the UK-ingredient version of this beer. The original ingredient is on the left, UK substitute in the right (but in a couple of cases I wasn't able to source a substitute and had to use an American ingredient).

It's mashing right now.

9 lbs Rahr 2-row malt.........................Crisp Maris Otter
2 lbs Briess 10L Munich malt.............Crisp Brown Malt
1 lb Briess 120L crystal malt..............Crisp Caramel 120L
1 lb Briess flaked corn (i.e. maize).....same US ingredient
4 oz Briess Midnight Wheat (550L)....same US ingredient
1 lb Panela sugar................................Jaggery from India
2 oz unsulphered molasses...............Lyle's black treacle

1 oz Liberty first-wort..............East Kent Goldings
0.5 oz Liberty (30 minutes)......East Kent Goldings
1 oz Citra (15 minutes)............Target
0.5 oz Liberty (15 minutes)......East Kent Goldings

Hop quantities are adjusted based on %alpha to yield the same estimated IBU.

[BrannigansLove]

Looks good, I may try something similar later in the year.

[Laripu]

Looks good, I may try something similar later in the year.

Which version are you thinking of? US, UK, or does the origin of the ingredients not matter?

It occurs to me that a German version might be impossible as they may have no counterparts to panela/jaggery or molasses/treacle. They don't use flaked maize, and it would have to be a lager. It would be mere schwarzbier.

I forgot to mention that the US version was fermented with US-05, and the UK version with Nottingham. I tried to get S-04, but I noticed that the ones in the fridge at my LHBS were past expiry date, and so the employee discarded them.

[BrannigansLove]

I'm not sure, maybe a mid Atlantic hybrid.


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[Laripu]

Update:
I had a couple of the UK Wolfe versions. Lyle's black treacle has a much stronger taste than American molasses. I like the treacle better in food, but in the porter it's borderline unpleasant, even using only 2 oz= 57g. I think it needs long aging to mellow.

(Molasses was very nice in the US Wolf.)

Also, this beer doesn't have much of a head. I've read that UK malt doesn't have a much protein as American malt (which allows American brewers to used more adjunct). It looks like the Maris Otter couldn't support both maize and jaggery and treacle.

To my surprise, the American version of this beer was better. The UK version will probably catch up in three or for months.

And the UK Wolfe has a nicer label:

[Laripu]

I'm not sure, maybe a mid Atlantic hybrid.

Don't use treacle! See above.

[orlando]

Enjoyed the way you explained your thinking through of both these beers, too often recipes are posted without that, I suspect because a lot less thought has gone into it. Your UK one you appear to be less pleased with and I have a some observations that might help improve it. I can't comment on the US components or the sugars as I have not used them with the exception of Maize. The two things that stick out are your use of Munich and Target, in my view a better UK substitute would be Mild Ale malt, though whether you can get it is an obvious issue. It has low colour, would give you the sweetness of the Munich and significantly has a higher diastatic component so helping with conversion. Your use of Target would have been better as your bittering hop, Target has a harshness that can "overhang" in the perceived finish of a beer, interfering with the malt character. This might be at the root of your "problem" with the black treacle and not the treacle itself, without tasting the beer I am guessing here but it makes sense. The lack of head is correctly diagnosed, this is or can be overcome by a bit of torrified wheat to keep it UK orientated. Hope you don't mind the observations as I admire the approach, just something to think about.

[BrannigansLove]

I'm not sure, maybe a mid Atlantic hybrid.

Don't use treacle! See above.

I shall bear that in mind!

[Laripu]

Hope you don't mind the observations as I admire the approach, just something to think about.

Not only don't I mind, I welcome thought-out observations like that.

The reason I think the harshness is due to the treacle is that it tastes like treacle. However, it's likely that the Target makes a contribution to that. In any case, I've found that aging reduces the flavour and aroma of late-addition hops, and I hope that's true of treacle too. So aging might take care of the problem regardless of the source. At about 7%, adding won't hurt.

The US version developed a luscious mouthfeel after about two months in the bottle. I'll be looking for that with this beer too. I'm wondering what the difference in protein does to/for that.

[orlando]

Hope you don't mind the observations as I admire the approach, just something to think about.

Not only don't I mind, I welcome thought-out observations like that.

The reason I think the harshness is due to the treacle is that it tastes like treacle. However, it's likely that the Target makes a contribution to that. In any case, I've found that aging reduces the flavour and aroma of late-addition hops, and I hope that's true of treacle too. So aging might take care of the problem regardless of the source. At about 7%, adding won't hurt.

The US version developed a luscious mouthfeel after about two months in the bottle. I'll be looking for that with this beer too. I'm wondering what the difference in protein does to/for that.

Difficult for me having not tasted that particular beer but in general I've only found bitterness to really change. In bottled beers I understand some sweetness might fade if the yeast can continue to feed off of it, my kegged beers only change in their apparent bitterness. Just as an aside, Target I used from day one and absolutely hated it, ended up giving best part of 2 kilos away. This was before I understood how good it could become in an aged English IPA, one of those hops that seems to improve with age, coming back to it after 6 months may prove to be this too. Interested to know if there are other hops that are better tasting the longer you leave them, emphasis on taste, not aroma.

[Hanglow]

I like target as a dry hop and bittering, I've not tried it as a flavour hop though as have seen it mentioned that it is harsh

[Barley Water]

I really like Porter and I make a couple of batches a year (I once had a quasi-spiritual experience drinking porter). I also have quite a bit of experience adding corn to beer and I have screwed around also with jaggery and molasses. If your beer is coming off as harsh I would be willing to bet it is because you subbed Brown Malt for Munich malt (assuming no infections, the hop calculations were correct and you didn't over sparge). Brown malt has a very aggressive flavor compared to Munich malt and I would be very reticent to add that much to a 5 gallon batch (although I really like what it brings to porters at about a pound in a 5 gallon batch). Any time you see Munich malt being added to the grist in an American recipe, it is because the author is trying to compensate for the fact that he used cheap ass US pale ale malt as the base which does not have the flavor of say Maris Otter (I would have just subbed Marris Otter for both the pale malt and the Munich malt in the US recipe). If the head on the beer is a problem that's likely because you have a relatively high percentage of adjuncts in the grist. Jaggery is going to provide sort of a subtle buttery flavor and the molasses in combination with the dark crystal will give you sort of a sweet, plumb/grape flavor. By the way, preprohibition porter is high adjunct and also a lager although I like ale yeast in a Porter. Regular American Porter is our bastardization of your very fine English or London Porter. As usual, we make ours stronger as well as hoppier and generally it is all grain.

[Laripu]

I may have judged too quickly. I did think aging would help, but this is five days later, and it's already getting better. Much sooner than I thought. I'm having one as I write this.

The harshness has diminished (still a tiny bit noticeable), but the treacle taste is still there - like molasses on steroids. What felt like harshness is turning into a mild chocolate-malt sort of taste, and it lets malt sweetness through.

My mind is changing about the cause of the harshness, based on your posts here (all of you). I now think it's probably the quantity of brown malt as Barley Water said in his (her? ) post. Luckily, it seems to be going away.

The mouthfeel is also improving. It's on its way to the lusciousness of the US Wolf.

What won't improve is the head. Low-protein UK malt can't support adjuncts at that level.

Still, in another week or two, I expect near-perfection. And I'm learning some things, to boot.

[WalesAles]

I expect near-perfection.

Lari,
Please don`t lower your standards!
Perfection is your goal!

WA

[Laripu]

I expect near-perfection.

Lari,
Please don`t lower your standards!
Perfection is your goal!

WA

Making ales great again.
7% at a time.