Any ideas for a Duvel Clone?

[moorsd]

Anyone out there know of a Duvel clone, or maybe a Chimney Red?

Looking to brew one for my next batch, but never attempted anything like these (Is it more difficult to get good/authentic results compaired to other ale styles??)

I've heard of Belgium candi sugar, does this make a vast difference over other types of sugar??

[tubby_shaw]

Duvel, from Wheeler.
25 litres
6380g pale malt
870g cane sugar
35g Styrian Golding 90 minute boil
35g Saaz hops 45 minute boil
15g saaz last 15 minutes of boil
Mash 67 C 90 minutes

From the Chimay clone I made I think that the yeast "makes" these beers.
Which reminds me, must go check on Chim Chimnay

[Garth]

yeah tubby, how did the Chimay brew go? any sneaky slurps yet?

[tubby_shaw]

yeah tubby, how did the Chimay brew go? any sneaky slurps yet?

Oh, the hardships I endure for my hobby
Into the garage, avoid basket of laundry strategically placed to hinder access to beer, circumnavigate various barrels and fishing tackle, to reach brew hidden away to quietly mature


It's been in the barrel for 12 days. Still cloudy.
It's very nice, got a lovely malty flavour combined with roast coffee taste and then the rather mild hop flavour comes through.
I've drawn the half pint off to let it warm up a bit.
Problem is that it is very drinkable already, it certainly doesn't taste like the 7.5% a.b.v that it is I think that I may put a warning label on the bottles for this

[oblivious]

Looks tasty!

[steve_flack]

Duvel, from Wheeler.
25 litres
6380g pale malt
870g cane sugar
35g Styrian Golding 90 minute boil
35g Saaz hops 45 minute boil
15g saaz last 15 minutes of boil
Mash 67 C 90 minutes

From the Chimay clone I made I think that the yeast "makes" these beers.
Which reminds me, must go check on Chim Chimnay

I think to get the very pale colour you need to go more with pils or lager malt. The recipe details I have are

OG 1.069 ABV 8.4%
Apparent Attenuation 93%
IBU 30
Malts: Pilsener
Adjuncts: Dextrose (17% of fermentables added in boil)
Hops: Styrian Goldings and Saaz
Yeast: Duvel (also used for Maredsous Abbey beers) - Wyeast 1388
Primary: starts at 16-18C rises to 26-29C. Lasts 120hrs
Secondary: Lagered below 0C for 3 weeks.
Bottle Conditioned at 24C for10days then 5C for six weeks

Step Mashed
Boil: 90 minutes
Bittering hops added 25 mins into boil and aroma hops at 60minutes

Apparently the yeast behaves differently in different brewhouses and getting the exact Duvel palate and smell can be tricky.

[onlooker]

Certainly you will need a lager malt to achieve the colour. Also the method Moortgat uses is rather important. The malts achieve a beer of 1056 (unfortunitly I dont know if this is a pre-boil or post boil gravity) which goes into the kettle with Saaz and Styrians in 3 additions. At the end of the boil dextrose is added raising the gravity to 1066, the batch is split and different yeast strains are added to each, after primary they combined and cold conditioned for 3 days, then they are primed with dextrose again raising the gravity to 1073 and the beer is bottled and bottle conditioned.
All food for thought if you are attempting a clone.

[SteveD]

You absoulutely have to use the right yeast, worked up from bottled Duvel, stated as being Duvel, or at very least a Belgian ale yeast that has that 'Belgian' spicy character. Duvel is full of it. Use a different yeast and it won't be Duvel at all.

[moorsd]

Blimey, sounds a little more complicated than I first assumed! Had a feeling this might be the case

Still it does explain why Duval is quite expensive to buy in the shops, certainly more processes involved than normal commercial breweries!

I think I might put this one on hold until I have more time to do it properly, I don't want to jump straight in and cut corners as Ideally I want to replicate the subtle fruit/Spicy tastes you get with it....and that sounds like it'll take work and patience!

[moorsd]

Primary: starts at 16-18C rises to 26-29C. Lasts 120hrs

hmmm interesting step, never heard of doing this in the primary, I suppose this would produce more Esters/Fusel Alcohols, and again give a unique fruity/spicy quality to the beer??

Not something I would have normally thought of intentionally doing....in fact I'd try to avoid it!!

[norman]

The recipe in Clone Brews. 18.9litres
4.4 kilo belgian pilsner malt
.23 k german light crystal malt
113 gms belgian aromatic malt

At the boil add 450 gms belgian candi sugar
700gms glucose

72 gms Styrrian Goldings for 90 minutes

Wyeast wlp 570 belgian golden ale is Duvels yeast

[steve_flack]

Primary: starts at 16-18C rises to 26-29C. Lasts 120hrs

hmmm interesting step, never heard of doing this in the primary, I suppose this would produce more Esters/Fusel Alcohols, and again give a unique fruity/spicy quality to the beer??

Not something I would have normally thought of intentionally doing....in fact I'd try to avoid it!!

It's quite common for Belgian beer fermentations to be run warm. Dupont Saison is fermented at or above 30C. In fact the yeast doesn't attenuate properly if it's not kept warm.

Some of the Belgian yeasts are pretty dull when fermented cool. Get them above 20C and they get interesting - just watch the headache though

[steve_flack]

Still it does explain why Duval is quite expensive to buy in the shops, certainly more processes involved than normal commercial breweries!

That's more to do with UK duty. It gets higher the stronger a beer is. My understanding is that in Belgium there's only one level of duty above 6% ABV and that's cat S. You might as well brew at 9% if you'd pay the same tax as on 6%

[moorsd]

Good point...forgot about the dreaded tax part of the equation!!