Brewdog dry-hopping quantities!

Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:26 pm

Browsing through the Brewdog recipes again over the last couple of days, after enjoying a mixed case of their beers over Christmas, and I couldn't help but notice the dry-hopping quantities for some (a lot) of their recipes. 250g (pellets, I assume?) in 20l batches appears to be the norm for their single-hop range (this is just the dry-hop component), with quite a few other beers around 300g and at least one with over 400g of dry-hops in a 20 litre batch. I must admit I have never come close to this level of dry-hopping (OK - perhaps once, years ago in an attempt at a Pliney clone, but even then I don't think it was that much). I routinely use about 60g in 20 litres, perhaps 100g or so in (what I would consider) rather hoppy US pale ales or IPAs.
Has anyone here tried any of the Brewdog recipes with >250g of dry-hop? I must admit I am tempted to give it a try, perhaps with a few extra litres in the batch so I have something left for the keg!

Mr Squiffy · Post by **Mr Squiffy** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:27 pm

I recently did their Punk IPA which had about 200g dry hop. Result was crap, I think there was far too much green matter in it, it didn't taste like it had been dry hopped to that extent. The aroma was OK but the flavour wasn't, tasted really grassy and not at all pleasant. I really don't believe Brewdog put that much in, I believe they put a lot in but not as much as some of their recipes suggest. I get better hop aroma's using only 50 or 60g.
Use your own experience would be my recommendation.

Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:03 am

I'm inclined to agree. They do certainly have some hoppy beers, but nothing I have tasted which really blew me away in comparison to similar styles I've brewed with perhaps 1/3 the hops. Quite a few of their recipes call for 400g + total hops in 20 litres, whilst the most hop-heavy beer I regularly brew is an all Citra number (Hop Zombie) with about 250g in 20l which is already fairly incredible fresh. Maybe the (lack of) freshness is the difference? I had a bottle of Jack Hammer tonight which was fine (if a little too bitter for my taste), but I certainly didn't get any sort of "300g of dry hops in 20l" aroma kick from it - and with Amarillo, Citra and Simcoe making up that 300g you'd really expect to smell it! (total hops in that recipe, about 1 lb in 20l).

Post by **orlando** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:07 am

I did a Brew Dog clone that suffered from over hopping. I don't know how they arrived at their home brew recipes but my experience suggested to me they just descaled their commercial recipes. There is something, probably still unknown, that occurs at a large scale that cannot be easily if at all replicated at our scale and the results show it. Less is probably more, I would halve the quantities and suspect would achieve an aroma closer to the original without the harshness of over hopping.

Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:43 am

orlando wrote:I did a Brew Dog clone that suffered from over hopping. I don't know how they arrived at their home brew recipes but my experience suggested to me they just descaled their commercial recipes. There is something, probably still unknown, that occurs at a large scale that cannot be easily if at all replicated at our scale and the results show it. Less is probably more, I would halve the quantities and suspect would achieve an aroma closer to the original without the harshness of over hopping.

I wonder if they have gone further and actually upped the hops in the home brew versions? I was always led to believe that commercial breweries actually achieved a better utilisation than home brewers, on average, perhaps due to process or something to do with the scale? For example, Sierra Nevada do amazing things with recipes that are not ridiculously heavy on the hops (if the clone recipes are to be believed). Maybe they figured we would need to up the hops to compensate. I'd also question the economics of beers with 20g of hops per litre. They are, of course, paying way less than we are for them but still?

MTW · Post by **MTW** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 3:16 pm

I would suggest that temperature can make all the difference here. No one has mentioned temperature. The exact quantities become pretty irrelevant if one person is leaving the hops in for a week at 20C, while someone else crashes cool after a day. I remember the head brewer at Lagunitas talking about undesirable flavours coming out over ~19C (he quoted fahrenheit) in a 2009 podcast, for example. They all have their own particular preferences, which includes a temperature schedule.

The equivalent of our 250g+ per 20L is not uncommon in micros. However, I did their Albino Squid Assassin with a 175g in 20L dry hop or thereabouts - by far the most ever for me, and got a grassy, even astringent slap that wasn't there before the dry hop. The next brew (own recipe) used a mere 100g and was great, but I also gave it much less time warm on the hops before chilling down to 12C and then 2C. The first batch had been at 20C for a few days. I can now risk going progressively higher, maintaining the same temperature schedule; one day at 18, two at 12, crash to 2.

Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 5:40 pm

MTW wrote:I would suggest that temperature can make all the difference here. No one has mentioned temperature. The exact quantities become pretty irrelevant if one person is leaving the hops in for a week at 20C, while someone else crashes cool after a day. I remember the head brewer at Lagunitas talking about undesirable flavours coming out over ~19C (he quoted fahrenheit) in a 2009 podcast, for example. They all have their own particular preferences, which includes a temperature schedule.

The equivalent of our 250g+ per 20L is not uncommon in micros. However, I did their Albino Squid Assassin with a 175g in 20L dry hop or thereabouts - by far the most ever for me, and got a grassy, even astringent slap that wasn't there before the dry hop. The next brew (own recipe) used a mere 100g and was great, but I also gave it much less time warm on the hops before chilling down to 12C and then 2C. The first batch had been at 20C for a few days. I can now risk going progressively higher, maintaining the same temperature schedule; one day at 18, two at 12, crash to 2.

True - and contact time, of course. I rarely dry-hop for longer than 3 days any more, as I get plenty of good aroma without the grassiness, and there seems to be some supporting anecdotal evidence to suggest that you are well into diminishing returns after that. I don't doubt that there are breweries using these sorts of hop quantities, but I am really hard pushed to detect it in the bottles of Brewdog that I have had recently (at least, since I've been thinking about it). The Jack Hammer being a case in point - if they really are using 15g per litre of dry hop in there then I don't know where the aroma has gone! (and bottle was fresh).

Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 5:43 pm

Was looking for a bit more info on dry-hopping in the recipe doc, and found this snipper under the Punk IPA recipe. 14C is certainly a fair bit lower than I have been working with:

To get the best possible profile from the
dry hops we recommend dry hopping post
fermentation for 5 days. Dry hops should
be added at cellar temperature. We find
14°C results in the most aromatic dry hop
profile.

Wezzel · Post by **Wezzel** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 5:54 pm

I can recommend 14 degrees for dry hopping. I heard this about Brewdog doing this some time ago and have used it for my last half dozen brews.

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Matt in Birdham · Post by **Matt in Birdham** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:01 pm

Wezzel wrote:I can recommend 14 degrees for dry hopping. I heard this about Brewdog doing this some time ago and have used it for my last half dozen brews.

Currently I try to dry-hop just a few points of gravity above my expected OG, in the hope that any introduced oxygen will be consumed/drive off (and in pursuit of the mythical "bio-transformation"

). 14C is not really compatible with that, but I might give it a go on my next brew I think and see how it goes. I imagine it will want a few more than my usual 3 days so maybe just follow the Brewdog directions to the letter (5 days).

Secla · Post by **Secla** » Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:35 pm

I thought grassiness came from leaving the dry hop to long.

Wezzel · Post by **Wezzel** » Sun Jan 01, 2017 12:47 am

There is a cheaper alternative too - hop aroma oils.

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charliemartin · Post by **charliemartin** » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:15 pm

I received a copy of Craft Brew by Euan Ferguson for Christmas. The Punk IPA recipe is in it and includes a fermentation schedule.
5 days @ 19C
5 days dry hop @14C
15 days @ 0C to mature.
Must be quite a big yeast pitch to fully ferment in 5 days, but probably not much yeast left for carbonating your bottles after 15 days @ zero centigrade. Not an issue if you force carb of course.

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