Boiler lid steam vent condensation management

[EccentricDyslexic]

Just wondering how you guys with lids on your boilers get on with the condensation? My boiler lid has an extractor fan installed in it with insulated 100mm ducting to the outside world but I still get condensation dripping back into the boiler.

I am thinking about making a Perspex boiler lid, but want to consider my options regarding steam management to minimise or eliminate condensation running back into the boiler....

Cheers

Steve

[Fil]

just a thought but as condensation occurs when steam hits a cooler surface, if you applied some heat to the lid assembly or insulate it so it matches the boiler interior temp you could cut down on the condensation, and as long as your extraction pipe points downward, condensation that forms in that will run downhill away from the boiler.

[EccentricDyslexic]

Thanks fil, I was thinking of using 6mm Perspex to make a nice ridgid lid and maybe use a couple of 90 degree elbows solvent welded together off it so that it dangles downwards as soon as it can, and insulate it somehow, that way it will lessen the condensation dripping into the boiler. It might look odd though, but that's a sacrifice I am willing to make in pursuit of the perfect beer!


Steve

[lord groan]

I don't use a boiler lid so this probably isn't particularly relevant. Just in case tho'
I brew in my garden shed with the kit on a wooden stand in the corner, I pulled out the nails holding the short piece of cladding in the wall just above the top of the boiler. I replaced the nails with 2 screws so I could easily remove the panel on brew days. A piece of ply with 2 fans mounted is screwed to the inside of the shed. It covers the gap in the shed wall and prevents wet air being sucked back in around the sides.


Then I made a plastic hood to fit around the inside of the stand above the boiler to try and stop condensation getting on the wooden stand and to close off the sides. I hoped this would direct the airflow straight across the top of the boiler, front to back. The hood is just polythene sheet but the bottom edges hang outside the top of the boiler and the fans are behind it so when/if drips occur they fall outside the boiler.
With one fan I was getting a lot of condensation on the hood and a wet floor around the boiler, stepping up to 2 fans has increased the airflow so much that it sucks the vapour out before it can condense, it has almost completely stopped condensation inside with just the plastic fan framework getting wet now.


i guess the principles are the same with a lid, you want some sort of hood assembly, enough airflow to extract vapour and fast enough to prevent condensation forming??

[john luc]

I built a split lid using plywood. The first half is hinged using a piano hinge so I can add hops during the boil without disturbing the 3 steam chimney pipes fitted to the other half of the lid. They are each 1" pipes and are set to allow the steam pass outside my brewshed.

[EccentricDyslexic]

Nice solution lord groan, but not for me due to having to having someway to stop steam going up my hopper tube and making the hops stick to the sides.
For chaps like yourselves, you either need a low heat conducting hood ie like a polystyrene lined hood, or a hood with steep sides so that the condensate can be encouraged to the edge where it can be caught and drained away rather than dripping back into the boiler. The other solution is obviously lots of air flow straight outside!

John luc, I have seen a few people using steel steam pipes, but id imaging you'd get quite a lot of condensation running back in to the boiler. Nice lid though, can you post better quality pictures? I have seen a few micro breweries with wooden lids, that's why my current (temporary!) lid is wood, but I get mould on it easily...id prefer something non porous and easier to clean and Perspex sounds ideal...but I am looking at alternatives...if I can think of any!

The current solution for me is as I described above, 2x 90degree 100mm plastic elbows so that I can get the steam flow going downwards asap so very little runs back into the boiler(apparently this is called a 'Retort' in lab speak,(thanks fil for that;-))

But id still like to fit some kind of shutter on the lid that I can operate automatically when the boil is finished, so im not drawing air over the top of the wort. I cant help but think I am also drawing in mould spores and bacteria laden dust particles across my beer which is not good Obviously the wort is very hot so its not a great worry, but my thoughts are about the cooler wort as the boiler is nearly drained that may not be as resistant to the bugs:-(

Steve

[Hogarth]

Here's my temporary solution...


There's a small weep-hole at the bottom of the u-bend to let the condensate out -- I put a bowl underneath.

[Hogarth]

Nice lid though, can you post better quality pictures?

Steve

I'd like to see them too.

[EccentricDyslexic]

Hogarth, lovin the retro light;-) reminds me of my own wiring:-)

Steve

[Hogarth]

Hogarth, lovin the retro light;-) reminds me of my own wiring:-)

Steve

Also 'temporary' -- Only had it for six years.

[darkonnis]

Just a quick question, why does condensation dripping back in bother you? I understand steam being an issue and I myself have had problems with it in the past, but condensation dripping back into the lid?

[JammyBStard]

I believe that the worry is that some dms will find its way back in to the boil. I know some commercial brew kettles have sort of gutters around the inside to capture the condensation and drain it out but I dont think its a massive concern if you boil for 90min. But in commercial setups if you can boil for 60 or even 45 and catch the condensing dms you can save a lot of money.

[john luc]

Find the system for posting pic's here a little awkward so here go's again

These are 1"fitting that can be removed by pulling them out of the lid. The fall is slightly down so no condensation can fall back into the Kettle.

[EccentricDyslexic]

Just a quick question, why does condensation dripping back in bother you? I understand steam being an issue and I myself have had problems with it in the past, but condensation dripping back into the lid?

DMS is one issue, but for me it is the potential for fungus spores and bacteria (that will flourish on the inside of the vent hose fed by worty steam that has condensed so is not hot enuf to kill the bugs) to be carried back into the slowly cooling wort that concerns me. So to lessen the likelyhood of any infections via that route I want to minimise the dripping of condensate that may be contaminated back into my wort.

Steve

[darkonnis]

could always add a condenser line if you wanted no steam or condensation. DMS will be driven off, it boils quite easily.
THe fungus is a fair point, but looking at lucs build that looks like a pretty good way of doing it.