Newbie after all the help in the world :)

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Hudson1984
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Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Hudson1984 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:25 pm

Hi all,

i've dabbled in home brewing for a little while - by home brew I mean beer kits in a bag, nothing major!

I've been looking at Keezers (for some reason it came up on youtube and now the gears are in motion)

sadly - and I realise this is a bad thing to say on a home brew site - I'm not really a huge fan of ales [-X [-X [-X

My grand plan, is to create a Keezer, with a tap for lager, tap for fruit cider and a tap for stout.

I've been turning my garage into a bit of a man cave so going the full hog and making it a pub with taps would be brilliant

is there a good route into this type of brewing? I don't really want to get a kit for grain etc if it's not going to be suitable for the end result.

I do want carbonated - I like bubbles :lol: so looked at cornie kegs and a c02 tank. But it's the starting point for the brew i'm looking for, should I just get easy brew in the bag brews and then keg? or should I be doing something else.

anyway, good to be here, thanks for accepting me and hope I don't annoy too many people with questions you've no doubt been asked a hundred times before!

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Jim
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Jim » Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:31 pm

Welcome to JBK Hudson1984. :)

There's nothing wrong with making a good lager - there're plenty of brewers on here doing it. Re how to get started, maybe look at one pot brewing systems - see the JBK subforum here - viewforum.php?f=45
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Hudson1984
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Hudson1984 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 8:39 pm

i'll have a look, would this be suitable for all of the above then i.e. could do a brew of larger, stick it in a keg, brew some cider, keg it, stout....you get the idea.

joe1002
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world [emoji3]

Post by joe1002 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:09 pm

In short, yes. You can put whatever you brew in there and it matters not which way you choose to brew it. So long as they are cleaned and sanitised before use you are golden.

Kingfisher4
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Kingfisher4 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:43 pm

Welcome. There are no stupid questions!

The folk on here are amazingly helpful, with no negativity, just a little banter occassionally. They have made a fantastic contribution to my journey from never brewing at all to producing 40 plus batches in just over 2 years.

The diversity of beers I have discovered and enjoyed making has been much wider than I expected when I started. Stout and Porters being my most recent revelation. You can craft beers that are so much better than most pubs.

Chug
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Chug » Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:11 am

Welcome, I regularly make batches of 12L of lager using a 15L pot on the cooker, no big kit necessary, look up BIAB brewing.

Hudson1984
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Hudson1984 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:18 pm

Ok,

so i'd like to get myself a cider kit.
https://www.home-brew-online.com/cider- ... ider-p1483
this being the one I'll probably go for.

would one of you kind lot put me a kit list together? i.e. to get this stuff from kit to your gob you'll need this.

Now, I'm still quite keen to keg as I want fizzy cider but if you recommend to start cheaper and smaller by all means throw that in there.

f00b4r
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world [emoji3]

Post by f00b4r » Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:59 pm

You can get fizzy cider in bottles, you bottle with some measured extra sugar and the secondary fermentation will make it fizzy. Kegging is great but you need quite a few bits a pieces and you will need a CO2 bottle supplier in your area.
Still want to keg or are you happy to try bottling (you can use PET screw top bottles) to see if you like it (it wasn’t clear if you thought bottles meant flat cider).

Hudson1984
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Hudson1984 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:07 pm

I must admit, I did think the only way I was likely to get fizzy was with forced C02, so i'll have to play with bottling as it may just be easier. Certainly makes cooling easier.

the wife is interested in the wine kits....9 bottles for a tenner means she's now keen on me home brewing too hahah.

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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world [emoji3]

Post by f00b4r » Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:16 pm

I would buy one of their starter kits then, it comes with everything you need including 40 screw top PET bottles. You can just reuse glass beer/cider ones if you have a capper but this will make it easy as you don’t have to worry about crud inside them and it’s one less thing to think about first time around. If you rinse the bottles as soon as you use them it won’t take much to have them clean to reuse.
If they don’t have the cider kit you want then one of the other big suppliers will do similar starter kits and cider kits. Just make sure they either provide bottles or a capper/caps for glass bottles.
Often worth giving them a ring as they will usually make sure you gave everything you need - it might be a bit different at the moment though as a lot of gone brew places are insanely busy due to Corona.

Hudson1984
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Hudson1984 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:08 pm

oh i agree, I actually can't find anywhere even open at the moment so i'm just planning whilst they're shut

WalesAles
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by WalesAles » Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:57 pm

Hudson,
Take a look at these for cider making tips.....
viewforum.php?f=48

viewforum.php?f=13

See the post.....`This is why it is called TC`..... :D

WA

Good luck with the brewing!

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wanus
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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by wanus » Sat Mar 28, 2020 11:02 am

Welcome to the dark side Hudson.
FV 1:Empty
FV 2:Empty
Demi 1:Empty
Demi 2:Empty
Maturing:Session bitter,Allendale Wolf (clone)Warrior Queen IPA
Bottle conditioning:Abdij&Allendale Wolf (clone)
Drinking:Mcewans&Session bitter
Planning:Elderflower champagne&Allendale Wolf (clone)

Keep yer pecker hard and yer powder dry.

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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by Northern Brewer » Sat Mar 28, 2020 6:28 pm

Hudson1984 wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:25 pm
My grand plan, is to create a Keezer, with a tap for lager, tap for fruit cider and a tap for stout.

I've been turning my garage into a bit of a man cave so going the full hog and making it a pub with taps would be brilliant

is there a good route into this type of brewing? I don't really want to get a kit for grain etc if it's not going to be suitable for the end result.

I do want carbonated - I like bubbles :lol: so looked at cornie kegs and a c02 tank. But it's the starting point for the brew i'm looking for, should I just get easy brew in the bag brews and then keg? or should I be doing something else.
Kegging introduces additional cost/complexity at a time when you've probably got enough on your plate getting up to speed on the brewing side, and on a practical note supplies of CO2 may be a bit of a problem at the moment. Proper lagering effectively means getting a fridge and temperature controller, which again is extra cost/complexity - but some lager yeasts such as Mangrove Jacks M54 Californian Lager will still be pretty clean up to 18C or more, and even something like Nottingham (or the Wilko ale yeast which is pretty much the same thing) will work pretty well in a lager recipe at current garage temperatures (but may get more fruity in a garage in high summer). So I'd do a typical lager recipe (just pilsner malt and Saaz/Hallertau/Tettnang hops) fermented with M54 in the garage and you should be fine.

So for extract brewing, if you assume a typical lager yeast attenuation of 75% then you need 1.35kg of extra light DME to make 10 litres (final volume) of 5% beer. If you want to make 20 litres, just double the quantity, and so on. If you want a 4% beer then just use 4/5 of the amount =1.08kg.

For all-grain, assume 70% brewhouse efficiency, then you need 2.35kg (crushed!) pilsner malt to make 10 litres (final volume) of 5% beer. Again scale it depending on what quantity you want, and what final ABV you want.

The attenuation of M54 is a little higher than the average lager yeast, so you can use 5% less fermentables than above, but your first all-grain will probably have lower efficiency than 70%, so it kinda balances out.

Different varieties and batches of hops contribute different amounts of bitterness, each pack will be marked with the % of alpha acid as a measure of this. In this case the sums are quite easy as the noble hops like Saaz and the Germans tend to have alpha levels around the 3.9% mark which is where one gram in 10 litres will contribute 1 IBU. So if you want something like Carling or Fosters you'd add around 15g of 3.9% alpha-acid hops to 10 litres final volume, for Czech-style pilsner you could go up to 40g in 10l. As before, double the amount for double the volume and so on. If the alpha acids are more or less than 3.9% then you have to adjust accordingly - you'll need 3.9/6 =0.65 of the quantity if you have 6% alpha hops, and 3.9/3 times as much if you have 3% alpha hops.

Cider can be as simple as bunging some yeast in some apple juice. Or to be a bit more precise, follow the Bulldog instructions but starting with 23 litres (or less) of apple juice rather than (their concentrate + water). Or for the full Swedish cider experience, 30% apple juice + 7% sugar plus water and some E numbers...

You can use the same yeast as before (or people seem to like the Mangrove Jack cider yeast if you are buying specially, even supermarket bread yeast will work though). Add a bit of artificial sweetener to taste, and add Vimto, Ribena or whatever you want to flavour it with.

Weird thought, but if we're sticking to just supermarket ingredients, you could probably flavour it with (dissolved) jelly - it's mostly gelatine which people use to clear beer with, plus similar E numbers to the one that the commercial fruit cider makers will be using....

Typical Irish stout recipe is around 70% pale malt, 20% flaked barley, 10% roast barley - so eg 1.52kg pale malt (or 880g pale DME), 440g flaked barley, 220g roast barley in 10 litres will get you around the 4.2% strength of Guinness. Cheap British hops will do like Challenger or Northdown - say 21g of a 7% aa hop to match the 40IBU of Guinness. Or if you want something closer to say Fuller's porter at 5.4%, then 2.2kg pale malt (or 1.25kg DME), 440g medium crystal, 350g brown malt, 50g chocolate malt and 16g of 7% hops in 10 litres.

I wouldn't be scared of all-grain - it does need some extra equipment but not a lot with BIAB, and it does take longer, but you probably have time at the moment, right? But it is more flexible in the long run, and rather importantly malt is about a quarter of the price of DME so it pays for the equipment pretty quickly.

As an aside - although most of the big homebrew retailers are swamped at the moment and have stopped taking orders, the smaller ones like Brew2bottle haven't. That may just mean they're being less realistic about how they cope with demand, but it's worth a look.

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Re: Newbie after all the help in the world :)

Post by WillH5080 » Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:27 am

hellO and welcome!)

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