Vanishing hop aroma

If you have a hop related question about International Bittering Units or alpha acid, post it here!
Post Reply
chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:04 pm

I have recently brewed a raspberry and vanilla smoothy ipa. This was a 25l brew and the recipe called for 1.6kg of frozen raspberries and 236g of mosiac pellets as a dry hop for 4 days.

Anyway when it came to bottling i took a final sample and the raspberry flavour was definetly there along with a very nice hop aroma and taste.

After being in the bottle for a week carbonating at room temperature i decided to try one. It was in the fridge for a bit and when i opened it and had a little smell the hop aroma has completly disappered :( After pouring the beer there is no hop aroma or hop taste.

I would have thought from the 236g of dry hops this would be a hop monster but its now just a bright pink raspberry beer. With no hop aroma/taste at all!

I have brewed a pale ale a bit back that was dry hopped with 50g of pellets and that one still has a good hop aroma/taste even after about 3 months.

I have not changed any my brewing process with regards the dry hop and bottling stages, so can anyone shed any light on this? Pretty miffed after using that amount of dry hops with no result.

On a side note the beer is very tasty with the raspberry flavour being very promanant.

User avatar
HTH1975
Piss Artist
Posts: 190
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:24 pm
Location: Thirsk, North Yorks (ex-pat Geordie)

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by HTH1975 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:04 pm

Might just be that the raspberry is overpowering the hops.

Fruit beers are normally all about the fruit.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:35 pm

HTH1975 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:04 pm
Might just be that the raspberry is overpowering the hops.

Fruit beers are normally all about the fruit.
Thanks for that. The raspberry flavour is very forward in aroma and taste. The sample i took just before bottling was very fruity but also had a very nice hop aroma and taste. Which is a shame that it has dissapeared in only 7 days.

gaunt_paul
Steady Drinker
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:18 pm

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by gaunt_paul » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:33 pm

Raspberries are a powerful flavour. I used 2 1/4 kilos in a 19l batch of stout last year and they overpowered it for several months. I wouldn't be surprised if the hop flavour and aroma are hidden by the raspberry rather than being absent

Sent from my SM-T585 using Tapatalk


Robwalkeragain
Piss Artist
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by Robwalkeragain » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:48 pm

Any colour change? Oxidation from the very high hopping rates is the usual culprit with these sorts of things.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:04 pm

Robwalkeragain wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:48 pm
Any colour change? Oxidation from the very high hopping rates is the usual culprit with these sorts of things.
The colour appears to be the same as the final sample i took just prior to bottling.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:59 am

Just a bit of an update on this. I have tried another bottle nearly a week later (so 2 weeks since bottling). Well, when i popped the cap and had smell there is a bit of hop character come back :)

On pouring there is definate hop aroma and taste. Not as much as when it was bottled but it is there.

The raspberry aroma and flavour has mellowed a bit and i can only assume allowed the hop character to come through a bit. I am going to leave these now for about 2 to 3 weeks and try another one.

Robwalkeragain
Piss Artist
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by Robwalkeragain » Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:08 am

Good result then! Out of interest was there much disturbance between the initial good aroma and capping the bottle? Moving it around, popping the lid can remove hop aroma pretty quickly, effectively venting it off. It's why DDH methods are favoured so much these days, the hops never get chance to interact with the atmosphere, just the beer.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:15 am

The method i use is to transfer the beer from the conical to a bottling bucket via a silicon tube. I then bottle from the bucket via a bottling wand attached to the tap.

When you say the hops never get chance to interact with the atmosphere with the DDH method , what do you mean?

Robwalkeragain
Piss Artist
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by Robwalkeragain » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:01 pm

The home brew version would be dry hopping under pressure in a corny keg or similar, then transferring under pressure to a new keg or bottles that have been purged of O2. Not saying it's necessary, but goes a long way to explaining why some of the commercial craft beers you get taste so fresh and incredible.
I would say you're losing a lot of aroma transferring to a secondary vessel, that disturbance will flash off lots of aroma. Maybe think about individual bottle priming for your very hoppy beers? Not too difficult with a sugar syrup and graded syringe.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:08 pm

Robwalkeragain wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:01 pm
The home brew version would be dry hopping under pressure in a corny keg or similar, then transferring under pressure to a new keg or bottles that have been purged of O2. Not saying it's necessary, but goes a long way to explaining why some of the commercial craft beers you get taste so fresh and incredible.
I would say you're losing a lot of aroma transferring to a secondary vessel, that disturbance will flash off lots of aroma. Maybe think about individual bottle priming for your very hoppy beers? Not too difficult with a sugar syrup and graded syringe.
I could give the bottling from the conical straight to the bottle a try. Wouldnt be too difficult to rig up the bottling wand to the conical fermentor.
I would only try this on some of the 'clear beers' i do though. The general reason i go for the bottling bucket is so if any bits come through from the conical they will get left behind in the bottling bucket.

But it would certainly be a good experiment next time to say bottle a few straight from the fermentor and then bottle the rest from the bottling bucket. So i could do a side by side comparison.

Robwalkeragain
Piss Artist
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by Robwalkeragain » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:18 pm

If you can cool your conical you should be able to eject most of the hop matter by opening the cone valve 4 times over 2 days, the rest will sink. You could always add a little stainless mesh to the inside of your conical to filter out any excess particles.

chefgage
Hollow Legs
Posts: 482
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:37 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by chefgage » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:23 pm

Robwalkeragain wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:18 pm
If you can cool your conical you should be able to eject most of the hop matter by opening the cone valve 4 times over 2 days, the rest will sink. You could always add a little stainless mesh to the inside of your conical to filter out any excess particles.
I dont have means to cool the conical. But its still worth a try.

Its still strange that i did not have the same problem with the pale ale i dry hopped. That stayed nice and hoppy for about 3 months bottled.

Robwalkeragain
Piss Artist
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Vanishing hop aroma

Post by Robwalkeragain » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:29 pm

chefgage wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:23 pm
Robwalkeragain wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:18 pm
If you can cool your conical you should be able to eject most of the hop matter by opening the cone valve 4 times over 2 days, the rest will sink. You could always add a little stainless mesh to the inside of your conical to filter out any excess particles.
I dont have means to cool the conical. But its still worth a try.

Its still strange that i did not have the same problem with the pale ale i dry hopped. That stayed nice and hoppy for about 3 months bottled.
Probably just better absorption with the lower hopping rate. More isn't always better! Well, sort of.

Post Reply