First wort hopping

[MattGuk]

Hi all, I am planning and making a beer that I want to have to be full of hop flavour.
While all my beers so far made with hops that impart citrus flavour have turned out fine, I feel that it's missing a certain bang of hop flavour.
I got to thinking that if I were to add FWH to the boil kettle shortly after sparging in a muslin bag, would this almost create the type of usage seen in the whirlpool?
I would remove the hops after steeping at 80°c ISH for say 20 mins before ramping up to the boil.
Thanks

[orlando]

FWH is thought to provide a smoother bitterness, some might say it's undetectable, but it isn't about hop flavour as such. That tends to come from later additions. Something that I have noticed giving better hop flavour is using the newish Incognito hop "paste", search on Malt Miller or Get 'Er Brewed. Adding this either at the end of the boil or in the Whirlpool seems to work very well and in addition improves aroma.

[MattGuk]

Thanks for the reply, I have always added plenty of hops at flame out and in whirlpool but just seem to get that punch that I'm looking for. When it comes to dry hopping I really don't like the idea of opening my bucket and increasing any chance of microbes getting in and causing a problem.

[orlando]

When it comes to dry hopping I really don't like the idea of opening my bucket and increasing any chance of microbes getting in and causing a problem.

Then you're missing out big time, if you like a lovely aroma as well as flavour. Your caution is understandable but just a little misplaced. Brewers have been dry hopping Beer for centuries with little to no adverse effect. The reason is 3 fold. Finished Beer has a low pH, alcohol and the antimocrobial properties of hops in it. All of which provides sufficient protection to accomodate dry hopping. So throw caution to the wind and get that lid off and bung a load of hops in. You can thank me later.

[MattGuk]

In that case I may well give it a shot.
Is there a certain time to add dry hops?
Would adding them at just after high Krausen be best? I feel like at that point there will still be a lot of activity, enough to push any oxygen back out.

[orlando]

In that case I may well give it a shot.
Is there a certain time to add dry hops?
Would adding them at just after high Krausen be best? I feel like at that point there will still be a lot of activity, enough to push any oxygen back out.

Good questions. There is a theory and some evidence for what is called biotransformation. This changes the oils in the hops transforming them from one aroma to another. This is supposed to happen at high krausen or just past. Another school of thought is to leave dry hopping until fermentation is complete. An area for experimentation for you. In the end what do you prefer? There is no wrong or right here, just different outcomes.

[WalesAles]

Matt,
Look at this post, see orlando`s link at the bottom....
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=82772

WA

[Rookie]

When it comes to dry hopping I really don't like the idea of opening my bucket and increasing any chance of microbes getting in and causing a problem.

Open the lid only far enough to gently slip in the hops and you'll be fine.

[Kingfisher4]

FWH is thought to provide a smoother bitterness, some might say it's undetectable, but it isn't about hop flavour as such. That tends to come from later additions. Something that I have noticed giving better hop flavour is using the newish Incognito hop "paste", search on Malt Miller or Get 'Er Brewed. Adding this either at the end of the boil or in the Whirlpool seems to work very well and in addition improves aroma.

As Orlando says, hop flavour is not really imparted by early additions, whether FWH or just added early in the boil. That is because the flavours you are looking for are imparted by volatile hop compounds which are driven off in the boil. Early additions are more about bitterness.

Whirlpool below about 79 degrees C and especially dry hopping do what you are looking for as said above. I was also very reluctant to introduce infection or oxidation risk with dry hops but have dabbled more recently with good effect. There is some theory that adding dry hops just before FG is reached then cold crashing and steeping for about 4 days in total is optimal, search on here for dry hopping debate.

[MattGuk]

Thanks guys for all the replies, I'm planning a brewing this weekend, all things being well I may try to dry hop maybe mid week next week when high Krausen has just about passed and almost down to FG.
I don't really have the capabilities to cold crash at the moment so I will leave it in the coolest part of the house for a week maybe?
Then transfer as normal?

[orlando]

I don't really have the capabilities to cold crash at the moment so I will leave it in the coolest part of the house for a week maybe?

You might find leaving it outside next week will help.

[MattGuk]

Yeah heard that the temp is meant to drop a bit next week, might stick it out in the conservatory in that case, also wrap it a little to keep out the way of any sun.