Windsor Yeast

[Buzz]

I did a search on this and found conflicting opinions. Is it a real bugger to clear or not

I'm a bit cheesed off with my local HBS as he never has much in the way of choice when it comes to yeast. I've been stuck with MPG for my last couple of brews and today I went in to get something different and all he had as an alternative was Windsor.

I bought some to try though. Is it better suited to a particular style of ale? (the darker the better so you don't see the haze perhaps). And, what sort of final gravity to you get with it as I read that it leaves it pretty high. If that's the case, would I be better using it in a higher gravity beer?

Feedback from anyone who's used this would be appreciated.

[mysterio]

I haven't used this yeast so take this FWIW

Is it a real bugger to clear or not

If some people are saying it clears fine for them, and others are saying it doesnt, then that suggests to me that either a) there is some other factor such as water mineral composition that is helping some peoples beers clear and others not, or b) some people are doing something 'extra' to help the yeast clear out, such as chilling or using isinglass. If you do have trouble getting it to clear naturally, either chilling for a week or so or using isinglass is a sure bet.

As for types of beer, to be honest I think yeast haze affects beer flavour as well as aesthetically, to me ales taste duller and less the flavours less 'bright', so personally I wouldnt specifically brew a dark beer to hide haze. As for final gravity, my understanding was also that Windsor is a lower attenuating yeast than say, nottingham. My inclination would be to use it in a lower gravity beer which needs that extra bit of body & sweetness to make it less thin and watery. If you're using it in a higher gravity beer then you may want to up your hop rate to balance the increased sweetness.

[Buzz]

My inclination would be to use it in a lower gravity beer which needs that extra bit of body & sweetness to make it less thin and watery. If you're using it in a higher gravity beer then you may want to up your hop rate to balance the increased sweetness.

If you use it with a lower gravity beer, wouldn't you run the risk of ending up with something too weak, if it leaves the final gravity higher than you would expect

[mysterio]

Weak in alcohol or flavour?

You can have very low alcohol beers that have good body and have lots of flavour, I think Brakspear bitter is a good example. Only 3.4% alcohol but it doesn't taste like a weak beer.

Conversely, I brewed a low gravity (1.039) beer with Nottingham recently and it dried the beer right out, and the flavour was a bit on the watery side - however the alcohol would have been higher than Brakspear (for example).

There is a real knack to brewing lower alcohol beers I reckon, it's not as simple as it's made out to be. I think a lower attenuating yeast is one of the keys.

[Buzz]

I did mean in alcohol but, I see what you mean.

I'm planning to do a 1036og tomorrow and I'd be happy with a 3.6% session beer but, if it stopped at 1018 and left me with a 2.4% beer, I'd be a bit embarrassed to offer it around

[mysterio]

Nah, theres no way it would stop that short unless you did something wrong, I would guess something along the lines of (all other things being the same):

Nottingham: 1.039 - ~1.009 (3.9%)
Windsor: 1.039 - ~1.011 (3.64%)

You might want to wait for someone who's actually used Winsor though, I could be talking out my arse

[Buzz]

Okay, that reassuring. I guess I could up the OG a bit anyway to be on the safe side and if it did fall short, I'd be okay. I don't think I'll use it on tomorrow's brew but, maybe the next one and I'll see how it goes.

Cheers.

[Aleman]

I use windsor 'all the time' well all the time I want those flavours in my beers

Its a good working yeast, it attenuates well, just not as well as Nottingham, but does produce some nice esters (very controlled though, not quite as extreme as SO4 for example)) and the fruity notes carry over into the finished beer (unlike SO4)

I've used it in milds where it works well, and have used it in a big beer at 1.065 which surprised me as it fermented out to 1.014 (Pitched onto the yeast cake).

It does take some time to clear, not being finished in 36 hours like SO4, but give it 10-14 days and it is dropping clear. If you want 'polish' it reacts well with finings - gelatine and isinglass.

All in all its worth trying, I wouldn't use it in a really hoppy beer as it has a softer profile which isn't suited to those beers.

[Buzz]

the fruity notes carry over into the finished beer (unlike SO4)

That's what I wanted to hear. My first few AG brews were done with S-04 and whilst the beer was very good, I found them very dry (I'm presuming it was the yeast). I've no problem waiting 10-14 days and it sounds as if it might go nicely with something like a London Pride or even an ESB.

My next brew is a low gravity golden session beer so I won't use it for that but I'll definitely give it a go soon. Thanks again.

[oblivious]

and the fruity notes carry over into the finished beer (unlike SO4).

I have noticed that with S-04 too

[bconnery]

I find it to be an excellent british ale yeast and prefer it to S04 myself.
I love the fruity character it brings across.
Great for a mild too because it brings good character but can finish short.

I know a lot of brewers who have struggled with this yeast finishing very high, 1018/1020 when they combined it with their normal mash temps.
When mashing slightly lower than you otherwise might they found it got down closer to a desired finishing level...

I use this as my english ale yeast of choice, with the odd foray to Nottingham for darker brews, and I'm revisiting s04 just for old times sake soon...

[Dan]

Ive revisited windor recently. I have 2 kegs and 100 bottles packaged up with ales made using windsor.
4 days primary 21C attenuation stopped. very cloudy
1 weeks secondary at 14C much of the yeast has dropped out
4 days in the bottles at 14C so far and you can see the cloud of yest falling day by day. it should be star before 3 weeks.

no finings were used
Im happy enough with the time frame and i think other brewing factors and water treatment have allowed the yeast to clear better in these recent batches than when i first used it.

[Buzz]

Good to hear. I'm looking forward to trying it.

[Danny]

I'm still fairly new to this and I'm using SO4 for every brew although I'm ken to experiment .. would those of you a bit more experienced with this recommend the windsor and if so what differences could i expect?

[johnmac]

You can expect very tasty, cloudy beer!