Persistent infection nightmare

[sbond10]

I wear nitriles and I feel no one's mentioned bottle caps and the capper

[bquiggerz]

Also use a fermenter with no tap for this basic "restart" I have never used a fermenter with a tap on, we have syphons for a reason, I use a bottling bucket with a tap on, that gets removed after every bottling session and cleaned then left off till the next. If its a small batch 2 gallons or less I just syphon anyway. You could also add some form of spirit to your sanitising arsenal to get four methods of sanitisation, heat, bleach, starsan(double strength), and high ABV alcohol, the spirit would just be for the start and hopefully clear the persistent infection

[Capped]

Then I rinse the tube off and through with clean tap water (thats the dodgy bit of my cleaning procedure - non sterilised tap water)

This is why I've suddenly become such a rabid convert to steam-sterilising bottles. I've long pondered the efficacy of spending hours at the sink with all manner of aggressive chemicals then to potentially undo the lot by rinsing with water which could be harbouring all sorts of stuff. Unlikely I suppose but ya never know. That possibility doesn't come into the equation when steaming.

[Davidman]

So. Update for anyone who is interested. I've come pretty close to giving up, biting reckon I can beat this little bastard of a bug.

Going to completely replace my tap, boil the absolute shit out of my fermentor (it should fit in my boiler), and go pretty basic. I'm even considering devising some kind of steam based system, as starsan clearly isn't my mate at the moment.

I've also moved the cat food just incase that was the culprit.

I'm going to brew up a pretty basic blonde/fake lager using mainly Pilsner malt, some hersbrucker hops I have left over and US05. Keep the process and recipe pretty simple, so if any flaws show up it should be pretty easy to identify. No huge in your face hops to mask things out.

Might even go back to basics with bottling as suggested.

Anyway. In other news I decided to make the best of a shit situation with one of my previous batches - a back ipa saison that got the lacto pretty bad. Racked it to a carboy and added the dregs of a couple of bottles of orval and another bretted porter (burning sky one I think), to see if the brett took hold. That was a few months ago. Definitely got that leatheriness already. I was going to dump some blackberries in as well, but I'm thinking it could detract what is becoming a damn good beer. Not the beer I set out to make, but way more complex than I planned. So. Not all bad I suppose.

[Mr. Dripping]

I haven't read the whole of the thread, apologies if this has been mentioned.

Whilst a good product, StarSan is not the panacea that everyone thinks.....it is not effective against yeast and moulds.
In your situation (and it sounds like your going this way) I would use heat.....lots of heat for a long time.
I would also invest in some peracetic acid (Perbac) ......go and see your local friendly micro
Hope you get it sorted.....must be hell. Good luck.

[InsideEdge]

I'm going with the environment you are brewing in. It sounds like you have changed/replaced everything else and already sterilise to a level beyond what most brewers would do.

Must be something airborne specific to where you are brewing. As you mentioned I would try brewing at a family members.

[TheSumOfAllBeers]

I have invested a lot in kit that can be heat treated for this reason. Stainless FV, silicone tubing. Still a work in progress, but all the bits can get boiled to sterilise if need be

[smileysaint]

Run 90c water through the entire process for 20 mins.

[oakerspocus]

I have had a similar problem in recent brews with what I think is a wild yeast infection... beers are getting drier and drier and once clear beers getting cloudy with time. Interested about the comments about Starsan being ineffective again yeast and mould. Will be getting the steam cleaner out before the next batch. Interestingly in my case I brewed two kits between the two infected partial mash brews and the kits have shown no signs of infection... must be my cooling process or post boil routine.....

[bquiggerz]

You could try a no chill brew or two as the heat would sort out any nasties you have

[Davidman]

Putting my plan into action. Bought a wallpaper steamer (already had one but it was a bit manky), sussed out attachments to tubes etc. bought a new tap for my boiler.

Fired up the steamer this afternoon, piped it into one of my buckets through the grommet hole. Feck me it got hot, I'm pretty sure it's as effective a steriliser as you can get. Can't believe I haven't thought of this before. Could have saved a fair bit of cash in replacing buckets.

Fitting my tap tomorrow and giving everything a deep clean, ready to brew Friday.

Going to think though my bottling plan of action for sterilising. I'm guessing the steam would melt an auto siphon? I have spare buckets to use as steam chambers to put equipment in, possibly even bottles.

[bigtoe]

build a frame that takes say 10 bottles from 1/2 copper tube, so something like this...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSXpPCrLt7A

Make it dual fuel so you can run water, then disconnect and run steam, so you wash, then sanitise/sterilise and pasteurise all in 1.

It is on my list of to do, not sure if a 20 bottle version could work, depends on steam pressure i suppose. This is the way to get bottles seriously clean and some.

Your idea of a steam chamber is good...maybe worth looking into also.

[bquiggerz]

If you get something that can hold some pressure you could have a cheap man's autoclave... Now that's good the big boys do it, steam under pressure kills anything.

[johnrm]

I had recurring infections about 18 months ago.
I was using starsan exclusively at the time.
I deep cleaned all my kit with bleach, and steam where possible - FV upside down over a pot on a stove.
No bugs since.

If you are concerned about airborne bacteria - some people use a Bunsen Burner while making yeast slants and starters - consider having a flame burning to kill of bacteria - a gas ring on low, candles or tealights.
If you get to clearing the infection, dial your defenses back a notch and see how you go, then adjust up or down.

[Davidman]

Brewed up. Tap replaced, steamed bucket. Cat food been moved for several weeks. See what happens.