Achieving charcoal-like bitterness in Pales

[Matt]

One of my favourite bottled ales is Bath Ales Wild Hare. To me it has a toasty bitterness and I wonder if anyone has suggestions as to how this is achieved?

I wondered if a small amount of black malt or roasted barley used to achieve this effect, or a particular choice of hop known for it?

The official description for Wild Hare is citrusy and dry, so no particular giveaways on the BA website.

Cheers,

Matt

[maxashton]

I can't find any info on the brew other than the generic organic spew. You could try phoning them and asking, i suppose.

[Piscator]

I'm aiming to get a similar effect in my next brew.

I have opted for a mixture of flaked barley for toasty/nutty taste and a smidgeon of roast barley for the roasty taste.
A reasonable amount of Aurora will be dumped in once the heat is off to hopefully get some of the citrusy flavour/aroma.

Don't quite know if it will work - but I'll enjoy finding out

[Matt]

That sounds interesting Piscator, when are you doing it? Have you got your roast barley at about 1%?

Yeah, good point MA, I always assume that breweries are reluctant to give info away but its worth a shot and others have had very helpful responses.

[DEV]

I had a charcoal tasting pint at my local recentley
it tasted like it had been brewed in a bar-b-que,
didnt like it much, to overpowering.
it was from the Hopback brewery, can't remember the name but it was'nt summer lightning
Hope this is of any use.

[Piscator]

That sounds interesting Piscator, when are you doing it? Have you got your roast barley at about 1%?

Yeah, good point MA, I always assume that breweries are reluctant to give info away but its worth a shot and others have had very helpful responses.

Hi Matt,

I have the flaked at about 8.5% and the roast at about 0.5% - I've started low to make sure I get a drinkable beer and can work it up from there with subsequent brews.

I'm planning to brew this one either at the weekend or early next week - depends on the weather.

Cheers
Steve

[Andy]

I'm aiming to get a similar effect in my next brew.

I have opted for a mixture of flaked barley for toasty/nutty taste and a smidgeon of roast barley for the roasty taste.
A reasonable amount of Aurora will be dumped in once the heat is off to hopefully get some of the citrusy flavour/aroma.

Don't quite know if it will work - but I'll enjoy finding out

Sounds interesting, please keep us posted

[Piscator]

For those who are interested, heres the %'s I will be using:

80.9% Marris Otter
9.3 % Crystal Malt
9.3% Flaked Barley
0.5% Roast Barley

I keep changing my mind about hops but at present will be hopping using Northdown as follows:

30g for 60 mins
22g for 20 mins
15g for 10 mins

To give around 40 IBU

50g of Aurora will go in at the end when the wort hits 70°C on the cool.

It's a bit of guesswork as to how it will turn out but seems to be a good starting point to develop the beer I want, which is pretty much what Matt described - and half the fun is in the experimenting
I'm sure there are some tunes to play using small amounts of other dark malts like Amber and Chocolate for more biscuity flavours.
I'll keep you posted how this one turns out.

Cheers
Steve

[Matt]

That looks really nice Piscator. Look forward to hearing how it goes, I'm going to head for something like it but minus the crystal… will get my thinking cap on.

Thanks for the input.

Matt

[stevezx7r]

If you have a look for my V-Twin recipe/brew day you'll see that I've used around 20/30g roast coupled with Cascade hops. The beer is almost ready (drinking it on Saturday for my brothers B-day) and after tasting it on Tuesday it has a slight roasty taste to it. At the moment it's overpowered by the green apple taste of the hops which I'm hoping will subside a little before this weekend. Anyway, if your after a slight roast flavour in your pale ale, roast barley is the way to go

[Matt]

Steve,

Thanks for that info.

Bath Ales have kindly responded with pointers - low colour MO, a small amount of Amber and First Gold only over three additions with a lot used late for aroma.

Matt

[Aleman]

Bath Ales have kindly responded with pointers - low colour MO, a small amount of Amber and First Gold only over three additions with a lot used late for aroma.

Oddly enough Amber would have been my choice, as it does dry a beer out and add a toasty/biscuity note.

[mysterio]

I'll have to look out for this beer, sounds interesting. They had one of the Bath Ales in my local supermarket, it was pretty tasty. Barnstormer I think it was called.

What kind of % of Amber are you going to go with Matt?

[maxashton]

'ere. How bitter IS charcoal?

[Matt]

Its a nice one Myste, I used to get it in ASDA, although I haven't seen it in there recently. I think they were stocking it as its organic, they didn't hold any other BA ales, but i'll have to look out for Barnstormer.

Its completely finger in the wind, but I'm wondering about 2-3%. Wild Hare is a golden ale so I'm figuring they can't add much of it, even using Light MO.

What do you folks think?

Incidentally, I wrote back and asked if they used a hopback - answer was no, the aroma addition goes in at 10 mins, which was interesting.