should I go into all grain brewing??

[beesley121]

Hi guys,

not been in the hobby long but Im now thinking of moving away from kit brewing to all grain!!

I can see the advantages, ie custom beverages to suit my own taste but whats are the disadvantages. One I can think os is the cost of the equipment at startup but this shouldnt be too bad as I have afew bits lying around that I can cnvert.

some please tell me w I should move away from kts to all grain before i change my mind

pS also one thing that I realy want o know is how much on average will it cost per pint as the grains have to be purchased, gas for heating ect

thanx in advance

[SiHoltye]

Do it, I'll bet my hat that you won't regret it. Cost wise I think my brews tend to be about £10-£15 for 25L so 22p-35p per pint approx. Dunno about fuel cost I'm afraid. I use 2 x 2.25kW elements for probably 90mins total in the day.
If you know and like the taste of good beer, if your a beer man, the cost becomes a little more secondary after you taste your creations. It's great

[mysterio]

I would go for it, the quality of your beers will be immense and it's great fun.

The major disadvantage from my point of view is the time it takes, brewing an all-grain beer takes the best part of a day and it's hard to find the time. Saying that, it's a fun day off and it's quite theraputic (assuming everything goes to plan...)

[beesley121]

ok guys, I can see u want me to join the all grain crew but one more question

" say I decided to make a clone of a badgers golden glory! how close is it possible to replicate such a beerusg the all grain technique or say a guiness clone

[adm]

Definitely go for it. You will not regret it.

I only ever made one kit then went straight on to AG - and the difference was huge. Maybe I could have made better kits, but it's just so satisfying to do it from the raw materials. Kit brewing was like sticking a ready meal in the microwave. AG is like proper cooking. It's a bit harder, but more rewarding - but it's not as hard as you think it will be!

It does take time. You need the best part of a day - but most of that time is spent waiting. It's perfect if you work from home some of the time.

As for clones, I've only ever done one. Hog's Back TEA and it came pretty damn close. I'm still drinking it now. I did use the malt, yeast and hops from the brewery though, so it's no surprise I got it fairly close. Next time, I'll try to replicate their water treatment to get it even closer.

Having said that, for me, the main reason for AG is that I don't have to try to clone beers - I can produce beers that exactly suit my taste and requirements. Once you make that leap of faith - that you really do know what you like, and you have a rough idea of how to get it, then the world is your lobster! The rest is down to lots of practice and refinement of the art...

[mysterio]

A Guinness clone is arguably one of the easiest beers to do, the recipe is pretty simple. The only thing is getting the pour you get from guinness draught, its perfectly easy to do but you'll need a kegging set up and a nitro mix gas source.

Badger Golden Glory, I don't think i've tried it but I would imagine after a few tries messing about with ingredients you'll be able to get somewhere close, and the attempts on the way will probably taste as good if not better. When you're all-grain brewing beer you're doing exactly what the pro's do on a smaller scale, so theres no reason why you cant replicate similar results, all the ingredients are there. Few home wine-makers, for instance, can say that.

[edit1now]

Costs - the last time I worked it out was in 2006.

3kg lager malt (£7?)
500g Caramünch £2.80

home-grown hops - free

Yeast - about £1.20 for S-04 or similar packet yeast.

Electricity consumption to mash about 18 litres, make about that of 77 ̊C sparge water, then 1 ½ hours boil = 10.2 kWh @ 11.25p/kWh = £1.15 inc. VAT

I'm now paying over twice that for electricity, but the malt hasn't gone up as much. Also I'm now using a March May pump (275W?) with the HERMS for mashing, and the last brew required both boilers for an hour and a half.

Still not on metered water so I couldn't tell you about water costs.

I reckon it costs me about £14 to make 20-odd litres, so about 35p per 500ml bottle

[wetdog]

I've always wanted to get into AG, in fact I bought Dave Lines books 20 years ago but didnt do my first AG until earlier this month. I think the thing that tipped me into it was when I started trying some of the better beers on sale - Abbot ale, Hobgoblin, Theakstons Old Peculier etc. at around £1.50 a bottle though, not cheap.
I've since made Abbots and Hobgoblin and so theres definately no going back to kits, non of which taste like any beer you can actually buy, just in the style of certain beers. I think once you've identified which beer you really like to drink you will proberbly make it over and over and then start buying ingredients in bulk to further lower the cost - I bought a sack of Pale Malt for £14.75 from a malster. At the moment I'm finding the biggest outlay is the hops but I'm going to see about getting those cheaper too.
So yes it does cost to set up and yes it is time consuming but really, how many times a month would you expect to brew? once or twice for me so finding the time shouldnt be a problem. One tip though, make detailed notes thoughout the process and you'll be well placed to repeat an excellent brew or tweak a not so excellent one. Good notes are the key to continued success! there is software available such as beersmith or promash which will help you. just see it as something to enjoy - a hobby and you wont go far wrong.

[bloodoaf]

Kits= Corned beef from a tin
All Grain = Fillet Steak cooked to perfection, roasted garlic, vegetables of the day, hand cooked chips, field mushrooms and a glass of fine chianti. All of course optional as are a fine selection of side orders.

I started on kits over 20 years ago when I was a student and dabbled occasionally but despite my best efforts the end product always tasted like "homebrew" and could not be mistaken for a real ale from a pub. 2 years ago I went to my local homebrew shop and was told that the kits had moved on and there was no difference between all grain brewing and the kit that he then sold me. COBBLERS!
4 weeks later I had 40 pints of "homebrew" again. That was the turning point and I bought a Ritchie bruheat and a fermenting bucket and some grain etc. I still remember drinking my first pint of Real Ale that I had made at home. No "homebrew twang" and better than my local pub's real ale which was saying something. I have since done about 40 all grain brews all of which were good enough to be served in a top pub.
AG is not difficult. You just need to be thorough, and you will be rewarded with beers of such quality that could not possibly be made from kits.

[BarryNL]

some please tell me w I should move away from kts to all grain before i change my mind

For me, one of the big unexpected benefits of AG is the huge amount of knowledge you build up about beer - particularly if you tend to experiment with a lot of different styles. I never knew anything about the different varieties of malts, adjuncts, hops and yeasts before I started AG brewing. Now I probably know as much as some brewers - and this really does improve your appreciation of beer. I can order a pint of something unknown now in a pub and have a reasonable idea of the types of grains, hops and yeast which make up its flavour.

[beesley121]

you guys are really swaying me to 'turn'

if I go down theis route, I will be making 10 gallon brews and kegging it all as I cant be doing with all the bottling malarkey!! Plus I have my own bar in my garden whcih would be great to serve this off next summer

If im going to make 10 gallon brews, can someone tell me what is the minimum size mash tun amd other things I will need to find in order to do this

[edit1now]

Get the kit to do 10-gallon brews, but do 5-gallon to start with until you get something you like drinking. 10 gallons of is worse than 5 gallons of

[MartialAnt]

YES

[sparky Paul]

YES

Well, that's good enough for me.

[beesley121]

Get the kit to do 10-gallon brews, but do 5-gallon to start with until you get something you like drinking. 10 gallons of is worse than 5 gallons of

Thats what I intend to do but Can you tell me what sizes I will need to get