Baby steps in AG??

[froggi]

Hi all
Looking to switch from kits over to AG in the new year and would like some face to face advice re set up, methods etc.... As I'm in the Sheffield area would like to "hook-up" with some seasoned AG brewers in the locality to pick some brains if possible... Can anyone help out please?? Cheers in advance

[Spud395]

Thats the way to go, in fact if you could sit in/join in on a brewday even better.
I'm a long way from Sheffield but i'm sure someone will help you out!

[micromaniac]

changing to ag will be the best mistake you ever made good luck

[tractorboy]

I'm just about to do the same, but I really am taking a baby step rather than jumping in the deep end; I'm trying BIAB (Brew in a bag). I'll see how that goes and then maybe progress to the traditional method. Just realised what section this post is in, so I'll get me flame suit and run back to the BIAB section

Bob

[Bribie]

Ha Ha tractorboy, consider yourself flamed
BIAB is a complete wort production system in its own right, no reason to "upgrade" to any other method. In fact after 3 years of BIAB including some big comp wins here (including a trip to New Zealand ) I decided to "improve" my system and built a lauter tun etc etc. After a few brews I sold all my new gear and went back to good ol reliable BIAB.

One advantage of BIAB is that, once you get the equipment assembled, you can take a deep breath, jump in at the deep end and after a wee bit of terror can virtually master the whole thing the first brew. Does help to attend a brew day however.

[Valley Commando]

I second BIAB as the simplest and best way to produce wort on a homebrew scale with a limited budget and time. No faff, no fecking round with tubes, connectors or pumps. Quick, simple (its essentially a giant barley teabag, the more you squeeze it the more wort sweetness you get!), minimum of kit to clean and store, a maximum of fun!
If Biab is like making a cup of tea using a teabag, 3V is like using tealeaves in a separate teapot.Only you can decide which way is best for you...

Get yourself a sheet of fine net curtain material, a buffalo 40l electric urn cheap from nisbetts clearance and you are away. If you later decide to switch (downgrade?/make life more difficult? ) to 3V you have the urn to use as the HLT to start you off.

HTH,

Valley Commando

[Eric]

BIAB is a cheap and simple entry point for AG, I did it for more years than I care to remember. That route could be the one you choose.

If you do start that way however, ignor the siren voices of those who's circumstances won't allow advance or, for whatever other reason, haven't advanced beyond using a rudimentary and somewhat crude mash filter. This Forum has mostly been used by people with with open minds and wide ranging interests in a great hobby, who have gone on to learn much from those who have pushed boundaries rather than strangling new ideas before birth.

If you haven't already done so, click on which you'll find at the top right of the page. There Jim shows step by step and in good detail how it can be done, even using a grain bag. I believe Jim has upgraded since then.

[Valley Commando]

One man's crude is another man's cheap and simple

The advantages of 3v are most apparent at largescale brewing. At typical home-brew scale, Biab has much to recommend it. But this thread isnt system wars, it is to encourage the all-grain leap. Sounds like the OP is making the sensible step by trying BIAB before committing to a 3V system.

There are some great vids of BIAB on youtube to give you a feel for the process.

[Eric]

Yes, I've seen a few of those vids and some good ideas too that might have come in handy had I known them when I started doing it nearly forty years since.

In those days there was no internet, no Youtube but when there was and I could, I joined Jim's Beer Kit Forum. Fortunately I wasn't faced with statements like

If you later decide to switch (downgrade?/make life more difficult? ) to 3V ...........................

that may just have put me off making the changes to my kit and improvements to my beer that I had at one time thought I never could.

The last thing I too want is, as you call it, system wars, but with due respect, if you find certain methods more difficult or make poorer beer, say exactly that to avoid any suggestion to others they will fail. Best wishes to you and good fortune with your methods, I hope they provide you with all you wish.

I still have two old grain bags and when I look at them I recall the pain from wet grain at mash temperature on every fingertip. At my age, I want it only as a memory.

[Valley Commando]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukPD_y5MJbM

I found this video most helpful of all. Not sure about the muriatic acid he added but other than that it gives a great account of what to do.

[Eric]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukPD_y5MJbM

I found this video most helpful of all. Not sure about the muriatic acid he added but other than that it gives a great account of what to do.

Each to their own. I viewed the video and while the method described wasn't exactly that in vogue when I started, it was reminiscent of some of my early attempts at brewing.

In a way I understand your enthusiasm and there is a separate section within JBK for those like yourself who wish to advance and spread the virtues of that simplistic method of brewing an all grain beer. The problem I see, and dare suggest I'm not alone, is finding certain advocates of BIAB acting like a twelve year old kid who's just spent an hour on his own in a locked bathroom coming out to profess knowing everything about sex and maintaining there's only one way worth trying. I don't share that view and find it misleading. Incidentally, muriatic acid is another name for hydrochloric acid and in certain types of water will, amongst other things, improve mash efficiency. Except in extreme circumstances, whatever improvement it would produce would not match the efficiency obtainable when using a typical, home built, purpose made mash tun, IN MY OPINION.

[Bribie]

I think the "defensive" attitude of a lot of the earlier BIAB brewers comes from the almost universal roasting they used to get from the 3V and HERMS / RIMS people - particularly on another large forum. Nowadays people going straight to BIAB don't seem to have this attitude and that's how it should be. When I'm doing a BIAB demo (like at the Systems War brew day for the Queensland Home Brewing Conference in October) I simply introduce it as a wort production method, not an A to Z brewing method, and the way I explain it is that most systems remove the wort from the grain whilst other systems such as BIAB and the Spiedel Braumeister remove the grain from the wort. Either route you end up with wort and, as you are now on the "cold side" of the process your true brewing skills come into play (sanitation, yeast handling, fermentation etc etc).
I've found that most of the hundreds of brewers I encounter on forums, at club meetings and just socially - once they have started to do AG then very few of them actually switch to another method. If anything they enhance their current system to make it less labour intensive (fitting wort pumps to avoid lifting half full vessels, welding up a SS brewing frame to tidy up the brewery, etc) but it's quite unusual for them to chuck their beloved brewery and get in a new lot of gear. Exception probably being the numbers who are now buying Braumeisters here in Aus, don't know how they are selling in the UK.

However as most brewers carry on with their known and trusted system it's really a bit pointless for BIABers to snipe at 3V'ers etc etc. All credit to this forum for splitting off a BIAB sub forum and maybe there's scope for HERMS and Braumeister sub forums as well, if the interest is there.

[Eric]

That defensive attitude may possibly have cost this forum the most prolific provider of brewing knowledge it is likely to ever have, however, we have hijacked this thread, a question that deserves honest and open answers, not those of bias and self interest, ignorance or callousness, but by the very nature of this subject, they can be wide ranging and diverse.

Froggi, it's a pity that so far no one close to Sheffield has been able to offer a demonstration. I could do one here, needing to brew for myself, but the travelling distance isn't inconsiderable.
My opinion is that if you stick at the hobby, your brewery will develop and change with time as you find new objectives, your strengths and weaknesses as well as with changing technology, costs and your lifestyle. If you can, or are prepared to learn how to build your own equipment, costs can be reduced or complexities increased for any given expenditure. as an example, my current mash tun came about when I found a coolbox in a shop for £7 which in a few days with bits of salvaged copper pipe and a plastic drum tap produced my clearest wort ever, a problem that had knagged me for years.
Have you a budget or any skills or passions?

[EoinMag]

That defensive attitude may possibly have cost this forum the most prolific provider of brewing knowledge it is likely to ever have, however, we have hijacked this thread, a question that deserves honest and open answers, not those of bias and self interest, ignorance or callousness, but by the very nature of this subject, they can be wide ranging and diverse.

Memories are short it appears. It was not the defensive attitude, but the outright aggression of said poster that caused the issue. Enough said on that anyway.

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Tapatalk

[Eric]

Memories are short it appears.

To be accurate, my memories are incomplete, missed the fireworks totally, there it was gone. So too was the greater source of information for my advancement in brewing.

Since then a few other notable posters have become conspicuous by their absence from the Grain Brewing section. That might be coincidence or just my perception, but I just wonder if they have become sick of their hard efforts being drowned in a sea of gabble from some that believe Dunelm Mill should become the premier mashing equipment supplier to the brewing industry. In my case, probably the second most important brewing advancement I experienced was replacing my grain bags with perforated metal filters. If Froggi wished to aspire to BIAB, might he not have posted his question there?