Help please review/advise my 1st conversion & procedure Thx

[VANDEEN]

Hi All,

I know this is long (I've typed it twice now as I lost the first one an hour ago ) so have highlighted the main questions in bold underlined
and would really appreciate your help / advice / input on my recipe conversion & brew day procedure, have I missed anything, need to buy anything else? I've read JIms extract & AG brewing tutorials if you need to refer me to those. Anyways.......

Having finished my brewery kit build (for now) I'm going to embark on my first ever extract brew this weekend (maybe even today ), based on Seymour's Saltaire Blonde Clone from this post:-
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=56797&p=596843&hili ... de#p596449

AG Recipe as below

SEYMOUR SALTAIRE BLOND CLONE (update)
All-grain recipe
6 US gallons = 5 imperial gallons = 22.7 liters

GRAINBILL:
85% = 6 lbs 15 oz = 3.15 kg, Low-Color Pearl Malt (can substitute Maris Otter)
10% = 13 oz = 369 g, Torrified Wheat
5% = 7 oz = 198 g, CaraPils/Dextrin

SAAZ HOPS:
.8 oz =23 g, 75 minutes remaining
.8 oz = 23 g, 45 minutes remiaing
1 oz = 28 g, 5 minutes remaining, steep for 20-30 minutes before chilling

Mash at 150°F/66°C for 90-120 minutes, or until thoroughly converted

75 minute boil

Yeast: Thwaites top-fermenting strain, perhaps similar to Whitbread-B (sold as Wyeast 1098, White Lab WLP007, Safale S-04, or Youngs) Ferment at 62-68°F/16-20°C

Prime with ¾ cup white sugar, boiled with a bit of water

Store bottles 1 week at fermentation temperature, then 3 weeks at 40-50°F/4-10°C.

Stats assume 80% mash efficiency and 75% yeast attenuation:
OG = 1.040
ABV = 4%
IBU = 20
Color = 3°SRM/6°EBC

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have to hand

1 Kg Extra light spray malt (mixture of Youngs and Muntons Max EBC 8 in 10% solution)
1.5Kg Light spray malt (mixture of Youngs and Muntons Max EBC 12 in 10% solution)
.5Kg Medium spray malt (Youngs EBC not shown)
.5Kg Wheat spray malt (Muntons Max EBC 15 in 10% solution)
.5Kg Carapils Malt Caramel Malt EBC 5 (Brupaks)
100g Saaz 2013 Chezch hops AA 3.07
2 sachets of SO4 yeast
45L of finest Yorkshire tap water
25L (to the brim) home made kettle
30L fermentor
23L pressure barrel with CO2 injector
3 Muslin Hop Socks
Will pick up a mash/BIAB bag tomorrow for steeping and maybe future BIAB use (do I go for the finest mesh possible?
Thermometers hydrometer, spoons, syphons etc

Conversion to dry extract:-

Do I multiply the whole grain bill by X 0.75 or 0.6 or whatever?
Do I also reduce the steeping grains by same factor? i.e.. X 0.##
Which of the above malts should I use, in what quantities, & when do I add them, see questions below

Procedure

Soak everything in VWP, not long for copper and brass parts, rinse well,
assemble kettle check for leaks
starsan spray immediately before use (when I buy a spray bottle tomorrow)
Boil hop socks in a pan for 20 Mins
Rinse BIAB bag in boiling water for 20 mins, (don't melt onto bottom of pan)
NB Check kettle tap is closed & hop stopper fitted & sealed
Fill kettle & bring as much water as I dare up to 66 deg C in my 25L kettle (probably around 20-22 Litres)
Put Carapils into MASH bag and soak for 30 mins, maintaining 66 Deg C (don't let bag touch element)
Remove bag and let drain into kettle (Don't Squeeze)
NB put starsan spray bottle away so as not to confuse with water spray bottle)
Bring kettle up to boil,
NB watch carefully for boil over
Kill heat
Add Spraymalt Do I add all fermentables now as per Jims extract instructions or only 10% of the lightest one as I've read elsewhere to avoid too much darkening but help with hop extracction?
If not all added now, when do I add the rest?
Start heat again (when do I top up with boiling water? continuously throughout ?)
Bring kettle up to boil,
NB watch carefully for boil over
Do I need to get some irish moss or equivalent to add to help with the boil?
Add first Hops, 23g (75 mins boil remaining)
NB watch carefully for boil over when adding hops
after 30 mins boiling add 23g second hops (45 mins boil remaining)
NB watch carefully for boil over when adding hops
after 30 mins add wort chiller (15 mins boil remaining)
after 10 mins add 28g third hops (5 mins boil remaining)
NB watch carefully for boil over when adding hops
after 5 mins flameout (0 mins remaining)
Leave to stand for 20 - 30 mins Do I stand with the hop socks still in? & With a lid on?
Start chilling (Do I remove hop socks before or after chilling?
Do I top up again here to 23L?
When 20 deg C achieved whirlpool stir, let bits settle into centre,
NB Check Fermentor tap is closed!
Slowly drain into fermentor & airate,
Pitch yeast

Ferment at a steady temperature until 2 consecutive days of the same hydrometer readings
Add priming sugar mix made with boiled cooled water to pressure barrel
Syphon into pressure barrel (Do not aireate)
1 week at fermentation temperature
3 weeks at between 4-20 Deg C
Enjoy Christmas Drink!

OK chaps over to you please

[seymour]

Here are my thoughts, but your mileage may vary. I don't claim to be an expert on extract brewing, I personally have brewed all grain from the beginning. No judgment or anything, we all end up at the same place: tasty homemade beer.

This grain-to-dry malt extract conversion should get you in the ballpark (I multiplied by .6):

1.91 kg Spray Malt, so of your ingredients, I guess 1 kg extra light and .91 light
221 g Wheat Spray Malt
198 g CaraPils, crushedafter dissolving the spray malt into hot water, add this to soak. The timing is not critical, soaking in the hot water first as you suggested would likely work too, I just think putting it all in there together allows any live enzymes in the spray malt to convert more of the CaraPils starch into fermentable sugar.

Yes, finest mesh bag possible, so as not to leak too much grain matter into the wort

If you have Irish Moss, add it with 15 minutes boil remaining. This is not absolutely essential, but will lead to clearer finished beer, if that matters to you.

Yes, leave the hops in the kettle during steep and chilling, this will lead to maximum hoppy aromas and flavour. Yes, leave the lid on to keep as much precious aroma in as possible.

The rest of your process looks spot on to me, you've definitely done your homework.

Best of luck to you. You're probably a little stressed-out, making sure you've gotten everything right and thought of all contingencies, but I guarantee after doing it a couple times it will become more routine and casual. Oh, and best of all, your beer will likely get better and better each time.

Cheers!
-Seymour

[Fil]

recipe wise i bow to Seymour ...

No need to preboil the hop socks to sanitise if your adding the hops to a boil..

and dont bother boiling the grain bag as the liquor will be boiled too.. clean it with a warm water rinse out but thats all it needs

fwiw my hot side equipment gets a thorough clean with water post use but never sees any sanitiser

If your using a glass thermometer Tie a bit of string/cord/copper wire round the top nipple and hang it up between uses they say they are non roll but i lost count of the number of glass thermometers i lost due to rolling off my brew surfaces onto the floor..

Its the initial boil thats at risk of foaming up due in part (i guess) to the release of any remaining gasses dissolved in the liquor this can be knocked back with a vigorous stir or/and a misting from a trigger spray bottle with cold water in it.

DME is a bugger to dissolve as it clumps up just persevere with stirring it in.. but dont snip the corner of a bag and pour it into a steamy pot as the steam will clump it in the bag and seal up the hole and make it a sticky mess.. open up the whole bag and tip it all in as quickly as possible

(not everyone will agree with this...)
IMHO if using dme you will want to boil all the fermentables for a hot break, I suspect this is due to freeze drying, as LME is already hot 'broken', but DME is not, i found this through making yeast slants and preparing dme solutions..

the cloudy clumps are the hot break formed after circa 25mins simmering

as you have made a boil kettle use it and use close to if not full volume, this will also be helpful as an indicator to the boil off loss you can expect with an ag brew and a full 90 minute boil.. Its high density or over concentrated sugar solutions that can hamper the hop utilisation
so not an issue if your doing a full or close to full volume boil.


Yes use irish moss or even better 1/3-1/2 of a protofloc tablet, and leave the hops bags in but dont bother covering with a lid, this time of year fungus gnats/wine flies are not a risk, and it will aid the last leg of the in pot chilling (see below)

Dont aim to chill all the way down to 20C.. the cooler the liquor gets the less efficient the chilling becomes.. chilling that last 10C will probably take 1/2 as long as the chill to that point if not longer..

DO stir during the chill to keep the hot liquor moving over the cooling coils but keep the stir below the surface WIth an IC i would chill to below 30C, the sit to let it settle will loose a few degrees, then pour into the FV through a sieve this will help aerate the liquor and aid chilling down a bit more too. you can safely pitch with the wort a few degrees higher than optimum for fermentation 24-6C as long as the wort will continue tio chill down to 18-20C the warmer pitch temp will promote population growth and have no flavour impact unless the warmer temp is maintained.

Most importantly if you screw up ( and you probably will make 1 or 2 lil errs).. cest la vie.. dont worry beer wants to be brewed so carry on regardless.. And Have fun

[VANDEEN]

Hi guys, thanks for your input & tips, I really appreciate the time it takes to give such comprehensive answers

As you may have seen in my recipe post brewday got put back to Tuesday evening, evrything is assembled ready to to a full hot wet test, steep temperature maintain test, and cool down test tomorrow assuming the mixer tap hose connector actually turns up

I hit my local HBS on Saturday and stumbled across one of the "Original" Ritchies "mashing and sparging bags" designed for the smaller old 25L electrim boilers so it fits in my converted 25L kettle perfectly, however I could only see the fine mesh sides when in the packet so didn't appreciate the bottom is a much looser weave. Due to this I'll probably split my steeped grains into a couple of double hop socks to hopefully add an extra layer of filtering for the bits of grain, but be able to let my hops "swim free" within the BIAB up until I need to add the chiller for its 15 min sanitation boil when I'll pull it to the side & bulldog lip it on to stop it touching the elements

Also picked up a tub of Irish Moss so will go with that as well at -15 mins to flame out.

Nice tips about the thermometer & cutting the bag fully open, the steam wasn't something I had appreciated, I've never opened a pack of dry extract yet so am yet to find out all of it's "features"

I'll hopefully be posting up the test results tomorrow, be interesting to see how effective my IC is with tap water, I've got a few pumps and bits kicking about from an old dish washer / washing machine so may work out some sort of ice bath/heat exchanger type thing in the future. I enjoy tinkering / building.

& thanks again for the help

[Fil]

the richie mash bag is a top notch bit of kit no grain will escape so dont bother with 2ndary bags.. mine is now the hop spider bag for my 100/80/100 SS Big brew kit



if it can contain all the hop debris containing grain is going to be no problem..



sorry to rain on your parade BUT.....
a 25l kettle is a bit small for 23l batches, check out these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-Plastic-Blu ... SwEeFVB2xW

£11 delivered for a 50l ex mango barrel - also mighty useful as grain stores/brewday stools.. tho they do need a bit of cleaning/airing to de-whiff before using as a grain store..

they make grand boilers imho,






mine was used for 23-25l batches and my preboil volume would be circa 30-32l

a rolling boil can use a good 5cm+ of headroom in a kettle to contain the boil and any splashes, and a slightly small boil kettle can be a real pita requiring constant mopping up of hot sticky liquor splashes and overspills i know my first attempts at AG were with a 5gallon to the brim burco ... 1 brew in the kitchen and i was banned to the patio to brew forever!! and the constant mopping up is a real joy of brewing killer..

[VANDEEN]

Cheers Fil, they are indeed a cracking buy for that price, mates pub has a couple of Barrel tables that he's growing tired of so he's already offered me one of those in return for a bit of work he wants doing so a new 50L kettle may already be in hand SHhhhh don't tell her indoors.

I now know exactly what you mean about the "headspace required" no matter how much I'd read or how many videos I'd watched nothing had quite prepaired me for the rabbit nose twitching of the nether regions as I ran it up to what I'd call a "raging boil" the draining board was literally drumming with the vigour of it

Anyways all went pretty well with the tests except my 15mm copper "Hang over the side thermowell" is too "Laggy" for rapid temp changes i.e. coming up to steeping temp which I well overshot due to the lag (The first set of temp values are the thermowell ones Tw).
The food grade thermometer is far faster reacting so I'll go off that for the proper brew (FT)

All temps in Deg C, Times in Mins, Secs
Start water Temp 15
Tw.....FT....Time
..........40.....9,00
..........60.....16,00
65.5...73.....19,56

Flame out, insulation applied, lid mainly on, fleece jacked wrapped round, double layer reflective bubble foil, and another fleece on the top.

Steeping time

Tw............FT..........Time
68.4..........72..........22
68.8..........72..........24
68.8..........71..........26
68.7..........71..........31
68.5..........70..........36
68.3..........70..........41
67.9..........69..........46
67.7..........69..........51................. So that's 30 Min Steep time over, elements back on. Timer re-set

GETTING UP TO BOIL TIME = 11,30

.................100..........11,30 Wort chiller put in, both elements still running
97.9..........102..........13.30 Raging boil 1 Element off, other on while wort chiller came up to temp. Timer re-set

TIME TO CHILL

97.9..........102..........0,00 Timer Started, all elements off, cooling flow started, intermittent stirring
51.0..........50............6,00
41.............40............8,36 constant stirring started
30.6..........30............12,19
19.5..........20............18,11
18.8..........19............18,26

No worries hitting a cold break there hopefully

So equipment is good to go, the only bad point was watching a slug come out of the wort chiller pipe???, is suspect it had been living in the length of garden hose I liberated for my tap connection to the chiller despite flushing them through last night. It's not been anywhere near where the beer is going to be so no worries though, certainly gives "food for thought" to all these people you see brewing outdoors & filling ther kettle up from the garden hose though

So pleased I hadn't dismantled another kettle for a tutorial / spare element as I lost over a litre just in the short boil time I did frequent topping up will be required.

I'll let you all know how I get on tonight, fingers crossed.