1.030 and Stop. Twice.

[gnutz2]

Rule out the aeation side of things because notty's a dry yeast and doesnt need the wort aerating, see the website under section 4 http://www.danstaryeast.com/sites/defau ... asheet.pdf

[tomc]

If it's not the aeration or the yeast. Then what is it? There's not a lot left to discount.

Both brews were 90 minute boils with hops added at 0 and 90 minutes. In both cases 1/4 of a crushed protofloc tablet was added with 15 minutes to go. Nothing else was added. Water was straight out of the tap and I boiled the full volume - it's not topped up.

No grains were added during the brews either as the Batham's recipe doesn't call for them. It's simplicity was one of the reasons I chose it!

Reckon I'm going to have to try something using different DME to check the technique. Ditch's stout seems highly recommended and looks about the only brew I could get into condition between now and Christmas. Time for an ingredients scavenger hunt.

[gnutz2]

I've heard that high FG's can be a trait of extract, allthough your case does sound extreme.

The only way i'm aware of to combat high unfermentables is to balance it out with fermentables, eg, brewing sugar (Dextrose), this should make the wort a lot more fermentable and bring the FG down.

Try doing a small batch with 50% LME and 50% dextrose, see what FG you get.

[jimp2003]

I've heard that high FG's can be a trait of extract, allthough your case does sound extreme.

The only way i'm aware of to combat high unfermentables is to balance it out with fermentables, eg, brewing sugar (Dextrose), this should make the wort a lot more fermentable and bring the FG down.

Try doing a small batch with 50% LME and 50% dextrose, see what FG you get.

I would try doing one of your previous brews again (maybe scaled down batch size) but using a different brand of DME as that seems to be what people are saying might be the cause of the problems.

Replacing some of the extract with sugar would only hide any flaw in the extract and would not be a great beer at a 50/50 ratio.

I bought some DME from The Homebrew Company in Ireland (they deliver to UK) and did a couple of brews with some steeped grains and the both fermented from about 1.050 to 1.010.

[gnutz2]

I was just thinking of a way too save the extract he has allready bought (15kg), but yes brewing the same beer with some different extract would be a good idea.

If the malt he has contains a lot of dextrins then thinning the beer out with simple sugars shouldnt have the same bad effects (ie, thin beer) it has on a brew with a normal percentage of dextrins.

Its a theory anyway.

[CestrIan]

To confirm if it is the extract you could do a forced ferment. Make up a litre of extract in a plastic sanitised bottle with 100g of spray malt to give you an SG of about 1040. Boil for 15 minutes, cool and then top up with boiled water to the original volume. Cool to 30C and add a small amount of yeast, say from the bottom of one of your stalled ferments. Then keep shaking/aerating it a few times a day and keep it somewhere warm (25-30C) like the aering cupboard. This will give you the lowest FG you are going to get with this extract. After 5 days of shaking at high temp check the final gravity with your hydrometer.

[simon50]

update:

i made pretty much the same recipe as i did before with DME from an alternate source, same conditions, same yeast (s-04), the only difference was a slight bit of different steeped grain and some alternate additional (to the same that i used before) hops, gravity down to 1.014ish (beer smith projected 1.013)

for me it's pretty conclusive that it is dodgy DME!

the "dodgy" batch last, did taste of "splenda" or artificial sugar, could there be a possibility that some bastard could have been adding some sort of sugar or sugar tasting substance of less value to DME, to fill it out ? and we were the unlucky recipients, unknown to the supplier ?

or is that my paranoia working overdrive ?

...it did taste alot like splenda

[tomc]

Update #2:

I boiled up about a pint of DME for 15 minutes, let it cool to 20C and took the OG (1.040). I then tipped a whole sachet of fresh nottingham yeast into it and left it somewhere warm (~22c) for about 10 days. Shaking/Stirring it every time I walked past.

After plenty of initial action, its now at 1.030 and will not budge.

There's nothing in this apart from yeast and DME... That's three separate attempts now, and each one stopped dead at 1.030.

Pretty sure it's not my technique or measuring equipment. I rushed a batch of Ditch's stout in the meantime. That hit 1.012 in about four days. My Dad was drinking it straight out of the fermenter on Christmas Day. I accidently brewed it short to about 5.7% as I couldn't see how much water I'd added with all the foam! Predictably he fell asleep after a few and snored right through Doctor Who.

- Fortunately I've not got as much DME as Simon and have secured a different batch. It's a lot of wasted effort though

[simon50]

hehe, i ventured £30ish for the whole 25kg bag, so although not a TREMENDOUS kick in the balls, still a kick in the balls all the same; i am not rich!!!

i know what you mean about the wasted effort, probably more annoying then the money!

glad you (or at least your dad) had something home-made to drink christmas !!!, i ended up buying cans

still shopping with the supplier though, just received some amarillo hops and yeast from them, may think twice about the DME now though!

of note if interested; got my "readily fermentable" DME from the thehomebrewcompany.co.uk, they have ALWAYS been spot on, but you have to spend £70 for free delivery, there prices for DME etc are good enough though (£15 for 3kg) not to mention that it FERMENTS PROPERLY (joke).

[dude]

Hello. I read this thread with a sinking feeling. I am an experienced extract and mini-mash brewer, and have recently made three 5 gallon bathces with light DME bought from Worcester Hop Shop (the first time I have ever used them). I used US-O5 & Nottingham, as usual. All three batches only formed a very small krausen and there was much less air lock activity than usual. I will not be bottling for another week or so, but strongly suspect something is not right, especially after discovering this thread. I do not know which brand of spraymalt it is (I ususallty use Muntons), but I did notice that, when weighing it out, I needed a much larger container for 3 Kg than usual. I was hoping that the chap from Worcester Hop Shop might be able to shed some light on the matter. Does anyone have any thoughts?

[crafty john]

Hello. I read this thread with a sinking feeling. I am an experienced extract and mini-mash brewer, and have recently made three 5 gallon bathces with light DME bought from Worcester Hop Shop (the first time I have ever used them). I used US-O5 & Nottingham, as usual. All three batches only formed a very small krausen and there was much less air lock activity than usual. I will not be bottling for another week or so, but strongly suspect something is not right, especially after discovering this thread. I do not know which brand of spraymalt it is (I ususallty use Muntons), but I did notice that, when weighing it out, I needed a much larger container for 3 Kg than usual. I was hoping that the chap from Worcester Hop Shop might be able to shed some light on the matter. Does anyone have any thoughts?

I bought 4 kilos of DME from WHS last July as my kids bought me some coopers kits for my birthday when Tesco where having a sale, I did a coopers real Ale kit with 1 kilo DME and some hop tea, I didn't take a FG reading I don't generally bother with kits I just leave in primary for at least 2 weeks then keg, although I didn't take a reading the beer tuned out fine, just to make sure I have just poured myself a drop to taste and it's fine, no nasty flavours or off tastes and it certainly isn't too sweet. If you do have any problems with the stuff you bought from WHS just drop them an email and they will do all they can to sort out any problems, I would like to add that from my experience WHS are a very reputable supplier and would never knowingly sell any duff products.

Keep us posted on how your beer turns out.

[dude]

Thanks for the feedback - I'll definitely let you know the outcome.

[Edd]

[quote="dude"] Hello. I read this thread with a sinking feeling. I am an experienced extract and mini-mash brewer, and have recently made three 5 gallon bathces with light DME bought from Worcester Hop Shop (the first time I have ever used them). I used US-O5 & Nottingham, as usual. All three batches only formed a very small krausen and there was much less air lock activity than usual. I will not be bottling for another week or so, but strongly suspect something is not right, especially after discovering this thread. I do not know which brand of spraymalt it is (I ususallty use Muntons), but I did notice that, when weighing it out, I needed a much larger container for 3 Kg than usual. I was hoping that the chap from Worcester Hop Shop might be able to shed some light on the matter. Does anyone have any thoughts? [/quote]

Hello,

Ive been a long time lurker and now my first post as Im also in a similar position to the above.

Iv been brewing extract for the last few years and generally hit my FG or where I expect to hit them with extract. I can knock out a decent beer but Im always looking to improve.

Ive used Worcester Hop Shop (WHS) light DME for the first time last year to buy ingredients for a few beers for my wedding. All stopped with high FG but not as extreme as 1.030 though. I cant recall the exact FG as well weddings and all, my notes are not quite up to scratch for those brews. All turned out well but were about 3.3% to 3.5% rather than 4.5%.

My recent brew is a Amecican IPA/APA. Hit all my targets with a SG of 1.058.
The 3kg of malt, some of the grains, hops and yeast was from WHS.

After reading this thread, I had a horrid feeling too, as the ferment was similar to what "dude" had. 6 days in the gravity was 1.041. I then gently roused the yeast, increased the temp and added a second pack of Notty.
2 days later the SG was 1.038 and has not budged yet. At present is an well hopped, 60+ ibu, 2.6% extra sweet soda drink.

I decided I had a few options -
1, dump it.
2, add extra fermentables
3, add some Brett and leave it a few years
or 4, which im planing to do once it arrives, is to add Amalayse/ dry beer enzyme.

On a plus note, WHS hops are fantastic, the Chinook and centennial ive got of them smells fantastic. As is there delivery turn around which beats quite a few of the bigger operations from my experience.

[tomc]

Hello,

Yep, this was a thread I started a while back now, and unfortunately it seems to have sparked up again. I had hoped with the period of inactivity that it was an isolated problem and no-one else was affected.

Since my 1.030 problems back in early December I've done two brews, both with a DME sourced elsewhere. One was a Ditch's stout, as I needed something quick I could rely on for Christmas, the other an ale with Crystal and Chocolate malts plus a good handful of hops. I used different yeasts in each. Both beers nailed it down to 1.010-1.014 pretty quickly and I'm happily drinking them both.

My problems appear to be entirely down to the WHS DME. The remainder of which I have now chucked

I will still use WHS for hops, as I have had great service from them and don't believe they would knowingly be giving out duff malt. Echoing Edd, I can vouch for their delivery times, something I'm pretty keen on keeping to a minimum when ordering liquid yeasts!

[Edd]

Little update.

The dry beer enzyme appears to be working with this DME, 6 days in the FV and its down to 1.018. If it finishes there I will be happy, hopefully it will actually dry up a little more. Time will tell!