Hambleton Bard s30 dispenser

[RICAM]

Hi

I have recently seen this system on a few sites and wonder what others make of it.
Iy looks a good system and has thr ability to be used for secondary fermentation.

http://www.brewmonkey.co.uk/product-pag ... 3d38d350ba

Would love to hear some experienced opinions.

Thanks.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

[Brighteyebeer]

I have no direct experience of using kegs adapted with S30 valves. I have used S30 cylinders with pressure barrels, and currently use cornies with a 'pub-size' 6.35kg cylinder.
I consider the S30 cylinders to be far too small to use with a keg system. You need to maintain pressure from keg to tap, and quite probably to pressurise a keg with a couple of litres of cleaning fluid in it to clean the pipes between kegs. I think you'd be off to your LHBS for new cylinders far too often, and it will work-out pretty expensive. Much more expensive if the cylinders have to be delivered to you. Bigger cylinders are far more economical.

[Kev888]

I've no experience of this particular system but FWIW here are a few related thoughts to take or leave in case they are of any use:

There are quite a few instances of people and suppliers drilling out corny lids for an S30 valve; they can work fairly well but these basic conversions suffer from a couple of small issues. The S30 valves used usually have a pressure-release rubber designed to protect plastic pressure barrels, which reduces the corny's pressure capability enormously - its not unworkable by any means but can be unfortunate for lagers and restricts use of the fast force-carbonation methods for other beers. It also isn't regulated, so maintaining pressure is a manual process; you can feed the keg manually to force carbonate as well as to keep pressure topped up but you do need to be there and remember. And finally the S30 cylinder itself is a small compromise; it is an expensive way to buy gas compared to bigger cylinders (though much better than the bulbs) so would be cheaper to prime rather than force-carbonate, then you would use no more gas than a PB top tap would. And the cylinder's valve can freeze up sometimes when releasing gas, which then causes leaks once the cylinder is disconnected - though running under a warm tap afterwards can solve that

Unfortunately I've no experience of this system, though it looks rather better than the (above) cheap conversion. Sadly I can't see the valve but hopefully they've avoided limiting the pressure unnecessarily. However the other things seem likely to remain, so should be checked out if they matter to you. Not deal breakers by any means (for most situations) but probably mainly worth considering if you can't get or don't want to use full sized cylinders for standard cornys.

I assume by secondary fermentation they mean the priming fermentation (rather than e.g. using it as a secondary fermenter). You can prime in a standard corny, even a used one if you first seal the lid with a healthy blast of pressure from a cylinder. I can't see if they've actually done anything special to make that even better, or if the 'adaptation' is just the cylinder connection allowing said blast of pressure.

[Fil]

If the s30 bottle costs £15? and a new chinese built 23l corny is about £125, then thats a £100 tap your buying with that kit OUCH!!

troll ebay for ex pub font taps and you will soon see how over priced that is, if you dont mind a bit of product branding you can pick up a font/tap for £10-£20 for something unbranded you will probably have to pay a lil more, the killer is pnp as they are all big n heavy so it may involve a little wait till something appears in your locality so its easy to pick up

2nd use cornys (19l) can be picked up from £35 upwards the cheaper needing more of a clean/service ( oring replacements) and carrying a few more dents but being Stainless steel they are virtually indestructable and can endure a lot of abuse..


with an s30 co2 supply serving pressure is going to be a hit n miss trial and fail situation..

and s30 modded cornies are far from new but still remain far from popular as they remove one of the major benefits which is controlled regulated gas pressure


No mention of temp control in the add, you cant keg without considering serving temperature as that dictates the optimum serving pressure for the level of condition suitable for the beer.

Not a good buy imho

[RICAM]

Thanks kev. Some great points that as a complete novice to kegging, I will take into consideration. I think i may email Hambleton Bard with a few questions.
Fil. Again thank you for your insight. Very helpful and again i will add some of your points into my email.
My own situation is that i am fairly new to all grain brewing and have recently bought a grainfather. Obviously there is so much to learn using the system and buying ingredients yeast hops etc. At present i don't want to get into reading up, sourcing and servicing of cornie kegs and various second hand parts that may or may not fit together. I'm no expert and want to concentrate on my grainfather and learning the processes of making good beer. I may return to cornie kegs as i progress and become more familiar with all grain brewing.
The reason the system appealed to me is that as a one box solution it certainly seemed a better bet than the plastic pressure barrels. In addition i would be using it to keg a beer say once every two months or so as i still like to bottle. Therefore the gas costs for a light user may be reasonable.
Im guessing no out of the box kit will be perfect but it seemed a reasonable system if expensive.
In regard to serving pressure, i assumed the regulator would allow control of that?
In addition im not sure how you control serving temperature as you mention with a corny keg? If that's possible, its certainly a game changer.
Thanks again for some great advice
Rich.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

[Kev888]

In regard to serving pressure, i assumed the regulator would allow control of that?
In addition im not sure how you control serving temperature as you mention with a corny keg? If that's possible, its certainly a game changer.

I can't actually see mention of a regulator on the product page, perhaps I've missed it. The usual method of S30 use is just to squirt some in by hand in short bursts until sufficient pressure is achieved; the system looks to have a pressure gauge which would help monitor things as you do this. Most larger cylinders use a regulator (though of course at extra cost) so need less attention to keep pressures as you wish and they have less tendency to ice up in the process, but the end result is very similar.

However, the pressure you need varies with temperature - so without temperature control a regulated gas supply, whilst no bad thing, isn't necessarily as advantageous as it may sound. For example, if the beer cools it will absorb more CO2 (even though the pressure hasn't changed) potentially leading to over-carbonation, or if it warms it will try to shed CO2 and cause foaming as you attempt to dispense. So it may still be necessary to juggle the pressure setting unless you have somewhere (such as a cellar) that changes temperature only little or very slowly.

If you can find an old fridge (or freezer) big enough for the cornies though, and fit it with a temperature controller suitable for maintaining cellar-like temperatures, then life becomes much easier. Its also better for the beer to be stored cool, and helps to reduce foaming if some/all of the beer lines are cool when dispensing. Not to mention more pleasant to drink on hot days. You may still want to turn the gas off between dispensing sessions even with a regulated system, to reduce loss should there be a leak, but otherwise its much more set and forget if both pressure and temperature are stable.

[orlando]

[
If you can find an old fridge (or freezer) big enough for the cornies though, and fit it with a temperature controller suitable for maintaining cellar-like temperatures, then life becomes much easier. Its also better for the beer to be stored cool, and helps to reduce foaming if some/all of the beer lines are cool when dispensing. Not to mention more pleasant to drink on hot days. You may still want to turn the gas off between dispensing sessions even with a regulated system, to reduce loss should there be a leak, but otherwise its much more set and forget if both pressure and temperature are stable.

Search on here for keezer or kegorator.

Another tip would be to find a guy called Norm on Ebay (others may have a lead), email him with your requirements, once your research has you settled on a cornie set up and he can put a package together for you, at probably a price that will pleasantly surprise you.

[RICAM]

This is mentioned in the description but I'm not surr how it has been adapted for secondary fermentation?..... From the advert
A pressure gauge is attached. The system is based on the legendary Cornelius keg but with ht e advantage of being adapted for secondary fermentation.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

[Kev888]

I too cannot see anything in the pictures or description that says how the system is adapted for secondary (presumably priming) fermentation. A standard used corny just needs the lid sealing with a blast of pressure to enable this, so it may be no more than simply facilitating that or it could be a better mechanical/initial lid seal, or perhaps a shortened dip tube to clear the sediment or something like that. If you find out don't forget to report back!

(You probably realise this but just to be clear as occasionally it causes confusion; pressure gauges do not regulate the pressure, they only display it).

[gobuchul]

As others have said, it looks quite expensive for what it is and S30 bottles are too small for efficient use with cornys.

I would have a look on line and buy a s/h corny, fittings and a proper regulator. If you want a fancy tap have a look on http://www.kegkingdom.co.uk/collections/beer-towers.

Also, find a local supplier of pub gas, a 6.5kg cyclinder will last ages if you are just using one keg occasionally, though if you do start using corny kegs then you will probably bottle a lot less, they are so good!

[orlando]

Have a look at this video, describes the basics in outline and should help you in your decision making even if you do this later rather than now.

[RICAM]

Thanks everyone for the replies. Plenty to think about here. I will look into the premium cornie keg full set that is available from keg Kingdom. Looks good for just under £200.
Is it easy to get a refill on the Co 2 bottle supplied with the set up.
Im in South Shields.
I guess there is some sort of supplier fairly local.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

[gobuchul]

You might struggle to get the cylinder refilled. Most places won't refill other peoples cylinders.

You could try a fire extinguisher place.

The best bet is to find a place that supplies cylinders rent free, you will have to pay a deposit which is refunded when you return the cylinder.

Can't help with the NE though. Ask the question on here and I'm sure someone can help.

[RICAM]

Okay. Will investigate. I have a few numbers to try. Thanks to everyone who replied. Appreciated.
Rich.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

[Scott-westy]

Ashleigh Gas Sunderland mate. Google it.

Sent from my HTC One mini 2 using Tapatalk