Best Online HB Shop?

[KevP]

I've done a Brupaks Fixby Gold and a Birkby Bitter, and to be honest I wasn't that impressed, just my opinion but I found then a tad too hoppy.

[WishboneBrewery]

I've tried a few so far, http://www.the-home-brew-shop.co.uk is always easy to shop at even if the site isn't that pretty.
http://www.simplynatural.org.uk is good for Free delivery on most items except Beer kits.
I'm just trying out http://www.brewgenie.co.uk and spending a few quid! So fingers crossed they deliver!

[shandypants5]

http://www.brewgenie.co.uk/ have never let me down so far.

In fact my last order was delivered 5 hours after I put it into their website.

but then I do only live 20 miles from the shop...

[Mogwyth]

Thanks for all your reposnses.

Re Brew Genie was in their shop in Shrewsbury last week will say very helpful lady there.

[garwatts]

http://www.brewgenie.co.uk/ have never let me down so far.

In fact my last order was delivered 5 hours after I put it into their website.

but then I do only live 20 miles from the shop...

I'll second that - quick delivery and very good at communication

[burgo]

POST EDITED BY ADMIN DUE TO THREAT OF LEGAL ACTION.

I have found http://www.hopandgrape.co.uk a lot more friendly and they have been patient with a noob trying to set up a Widget World to a Cornelius keg so they can't be that bad http://www.brewingshop.co.uk have also been pretty good with advice and assistance so I would also use them again.

[StrangeBrew]

I normally use Hop & Grape and have had no problems. Also used BrewGenie in the past and would happily do so again.
I put an order in to Barley Bottom on Sunday and received it Tuesday morning, I'll be going back there! (cheers Reaper )

[slipperywidget]

Sorry for the long post, but anyone buying online should read this.

I'm a freelance software developer and do a lot of work on secure ecommerce payment systems and thought you should all be aware of something.

On the home page of the hopandgrape website they state

The difference between the old and new V.A.T. rates will be deducted from orders when we process the order (when ready for despatch) as we do not have time to change all the prices on the web site at the moment.

This suggests their payment system is not totaly secure. You may type your card details into a secure page, but it does not look like the card details are not being processed securely. The only way they can change the amount you are being charged after you place your order is if they are processing the payments manually via a PDQ machine. In other words they are typing your credit card details into the type of machine you see in small shops and restaurants - This is exactly how most credit card fraud happens.

The Home Brew Shop site states

SORRY if you have placed a order around the 6th - 7th March with order number betweenxxxxxxx10014900 and xxxxxxxx 10014936, Due to our computer crashing While downloading the orders from the secured server we have not recived the orders from the numbers above I would ask you to re-submit the orders please, YOU will not be chargedtwice, becuase we can't charge for orders we don't receive if you have any questions please phone Sorry for any delays and problems caused

Again - how are they going to not charge twice for the order if the order has already been processed once? It suggests payments are being processed manually in an insecure manor.

With true online payment systems no one ever sees your payment details - the computers and software process your payment and the card details discarded. It's very complex, highly secure and happens in a couple of seconds. In fact, contrary to what many people believe, paying online is the safest way to use a credit card because NO ONE can steal your card details.

If you use a site that processes credit card details in this “offline” way you are leaving yourself open to credit card fraud. I'm not saying the owners are fraudulent, I am sure they're not. But, if they are printing the numbers off, then entering them into the PDQ or terminal - What happens to the piece of paper - If it goes in the bin and out with the rubbish, anyone can find it.

This is a common problem with ecommerce sites run by small shops because they pay less commission if they use their PDQ machine. Truly secure system cost more to run, so they have to pay more to use them

Don’t let this put you off shopping online. Most sites are very secure and you’ll never have a problem.

If in doubt, check any FAQ or about us pages on the site or ask before paying!

[Mr Achura]

most card fraud happens in petrol stations / resturants
when cards get cloned, these clones are then used online which gives online companies a bad name
little fruad happens at small business's because the owner is accountable, not just a employee at a resturant or the guy / girl behind the counter
( unlesss its easy brew, or what ever they call them selves these days)
always used The home brew shop never had a problem,

BUT as always with ALL mail order always use a CREDIT CARD, NEVER NEVER A DEBIT CARD

A debit card is your money, a credit card is not your money, they cant empty what is not yours

sounds like to me slipperywidget is another hbs, trying to give, 2 of the best hbs in the UK a bad name
I dont think anyone on Jims has ever had a payment problem with either hopandgrape or the home brew shop

[slipperywidget]

As mentioned, I'm a freelance software developer and I'm currently working for Ford Motor Co., not a home brew shop.

Last night, I searched Google for shop reviews and came across this page. I went to use the Hop and Grape website based upon the recommendations on this site. But after seeing the home page I was horrified and certainly won't be using them until I'm sure their security is tight. I'm not saying the shops are committing fraud - in fact I seriously doubt it. All I'm doing is letting you have the benefit of my expertise - it's up to you what you do with it.

If these companies are processing payments using their PDQ machines, it's at best irresponsible, possibly illegal, against the PCI standards which govern how credit/debit card payments are processed - You can read more on the Mastercard or Visa websites if you have trouble sleeping at night.

Your comment about the business owner being accountable is also incorrect, it's the merchant who has fraud committed against them who suffers.

[Lillywhite]

I have spoken to Hop and Grape since they are an excellent retailer this morning regarding the above and the lady I spoke to will discuss this with the owners who will, hopefully, rectify.

[boingy]

Hop and Grape charge the card manually because the final amount you pay depends upon their stock levels and the actual postage they will charge. Every order I have placed so far has been a bit cheaper than the online form showed, usually because of reduced postage.

Slippery, I know what you are saying but personally I think you are being a bit paranoid. The H&G system is just as secure as phoning them up and giving the payment details verbally.

[Lillywhite]

Hop and Grape charge the card manually because the final amount you pay depends upon their stock levels and the actual postage they will charge. Every order I have placed so far has been a bit cheaper than the online form showed, usually because of reduced postage.

Slippery, I know what you are saying but personally I think you are being a bit paranoid. The H&G system is just as secure as phoning them up and giving the payment details verbally.

It's not reduced postage but a reduction in the VAT rate effective from last December. I've emailed Patsy at Hop and Grape buecause I don't want to see an excellent retailer suffer because of this problem.

Paranoid? I've had credit cards since their introduction in 1973 with no problem until last month when my bank contacted me regarding activity on my credit card in Australia and USA, without my knowledge, and they cancelled my card and issued me with a new one with a different account number.

[boingy]

Lillywhite, my "paranoid" remark was to Slippery, not you!

H&G do also adjust postage rates on small orders. My last order only cost a couple of quid for postage.
And, yes, they are easily one of the best mail order HB shops in the country.

[Andy]

I use loads of sites which obviously enter online orders into a PDQ machine, I'm happy to accept the potential (very small) risk of a dodgy retailer nabbing my card info. Most small retailers can't afford the sort of integrated payment solution you describe and so use the manual method instead.