Newbie problem with fermentation.

[repton]

Morning all,

Complete newbie here, trying to brew from a kit and not doing very well so far...

We're using a "Geordie Yorkshire Bitter" kit, and a kit we've bought consisting of a fermenting bucket, pressure vessel and the other bits to go with them.

We put it all together on Friday but we're still struggling to get the fermentation to start. I think the issue is probably that we followed the really basic instructions that came with the beer kit rather than doing the sensible thing and looking online before we started. We didn't agitate it very much to get air into the wort before we put the yeast in, for a start, and also I think with hindsight we should probably have used a bit more boiling and bit less cold water in the mix as I think it came out a little cool to start the fermentation (only ~18C when apparently nearer 24C is better). It is showing a slight amount of froth on the top but we're not seeing any bubbles coming through the water in the bubbler on the top. Can anyone give us any hints on how to get it going properly?

The other problem is this - we have no central heating in our house and so keeping the temperature steady is going to be tricky. We've put it in our sitting room where the open fire is and the temperature of the beer is varying between about 24C when we go to bed on a night and 18C of a morning. Is this a problem? Would we be wise to buy some kind of heater to help keep the temperature more stable?

Thanks in advance,
Paul

[cwrw gwent]

Hi Paul, and welcome to the forum.

It sounds as though you're doing fine. The temperature range of 18 to 24C is OK but you may want to cover the sides of the fermenting vessel with a duvet or sleeping bag to ensure the temperature doesn't fluctuate too widely and to ensure it doesn't drop too low when the nights turn frosty. It's been quite mild lately (wet and mild in South Wales at least).

Keep the fermenting vessel away from the fire or any other form of direct heat, again to ensure a constant temperature.

If there is foam on top of the brew the chances are it is fermenting nicely. Is there a ring of yeast just above the wort to indicate that fermentation took off?

Given that you started on Friday you should take a look at the wort on Wednesday or Thursday and check to see if the gravity is around 1010 or lower. If it stays constant for two or three days it's OK to put in the barrel. If you used Spraymalt or liquid malt extract in place of sugar the final gravity may be a little higher as malt extracts don't ferment as fully as Tate & Lyle, which is a good thing because the beer will have more flavour and body.

Finally, take a good look around this forum and you'll find that this type of question occurs again and again. Virtually everybody here is very helpful and I'm sure someone else will be along soon if there is anything useful to add.

[prolix]

fermentation buckets are not air tight so I doubt you would get any bubbles through the airlock as the co2 will just leave other ways.

If the room fluctuates between 24 and 18 then there will not be any problem the fermenter will not fluctuate as its thermal mass will be too great for the room temp to have a great effect, I should imagine it will sit at about 22.

best thing to do is ensure the wort is aerated next time, 5 full mins of beating should be ok.

you should start to see a layer of sediment at the bottom of the bucket, as for when it's done I just leave it for 10 days then check the gravity and barrel.

enjoy your brew

[fractureman]

sounds like your brew is going ok, do you have a good head of froth above it?? We have central heating in our house but I always use an imersion heater on both my FV's just to keep it easy & a leave & forget answer.

as mentioned about 7 days is a normal time to ferment, you need to wait until you have a couple of days of steady readings on your hydrometer

[Middo]

As stated above, if there's foam on top then it's going fine.

If you're worried about maintaining a good temperature, you could try the aforementioned sleeping bag, duvet and immersion heater approaches. I actually bought a heat belt from my local HB shop today - it was £18.99 and is basically a thin rubber belt that you wrap around your FV, then plug into the mains. It will keep the beer at about 23-24C in most conditions. Good luck!

[repton]

Hello all and thanks for your replies (and for not flaming me for asking a question that you're probably all sick to death of hearing).

Is there a ring of yeast just above the wort to indicate that fermentation took off?

You mean something like in this photo?

I've just popped the lid and had a look inside and there is a reasonable amount of froth so perhaps I was worrying for no reason and it was just a bit slow to get started for some reason.

We've moved it a bit away from the fireplace and started wrapping it in an old duvet now to keep it from getting too cold at night so hopefully that will help keep the temperature in the right range. We're toying with the idea of one of those beer belts or an immersion heater, especially as this house can be pretty cold in the winter (on one of the colder nights last year the condensation actually froze on the inside of our bedroom window!) but for the time being we're trying to see what we can do without spending any more money.

Thanks again all for your help.

Paul

[cwrw gwent]

This looks fine to me. Geordie Yorkshire Bitter is not a flamboyant fermenter. It just gets on quietly with the job. By comparison, I've just started a Coopers Stout kit and there really is no mistaking whether that has fermented or not. See some of the pictures on previous threads.

As regards saving money, it may be cheaper in the long run to invest in a heater for the really cold nights rather than throw 40 pints of ale down the sink.

Good luck - let us know how you get on.

[Ditch]

I actually bought a heat belt from my local HB shop today - it was £18.99 and is basically a thin rubber belt that you wrap around your FV, then plug into the mains. It will keep the beer at about 23-24C in most conditions.

No disrespect, Middo, but; A few quid more could've bought ye a damn good 'Fish Tank Heater / Thermostat' combo job.

That'd keep ye beer at pretty much exactly 18 - 25F, or any degree between, above or below, which ye chose to set it at, with a twist or forefinger and thumb.

Those 'Brew Belt' things just seem to be so hit and miss. They need constant nannying and frigging about with. More art than science.

Ever seen a tank full of Tropical Fish, which a rubber belt round it ~ and some stressed out soul dashing out every few hours to check the temperature, and wiggle the thing up or down? Ever seen a fish tank wrapped in a duvet?! Hey! Ever seen Liam Neeson in " Taken " ? I did. Just the other night. Cracking film, start to finish!

..... Damn! I'm smashed and drifting off topic again!

[fractureman]

I got to agree with ditch the aqua heaters are loads cheaper got mine of ebay for £10 delivered, as well as buying an electrim one from a HBS for about double the price.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HAGEN-ELITE-QUALI ... 2001r39825

[scottmoss]

They are cheaper and better but more hassle getting your fv to use it i.e cutting the hole to put the heater in and also resealing it.

[fractureman]

erm no, just have the lead going in round the side of the FV it gives you the outlet your brew needs to let out the CO2, Also I know from friends who work at locaal breweries that they ferment over open containers anyway.
I've never had any foreign object enter any of my brews. You can use a rubber bung & drill the lid if you want but there is really no reason to

[Ditch]

Pans People. Tate & Lyle. Damp Towels ..... Halcyon Days .....

Actually, I suspect it's been the simple, commercial expedient of producers adding an air lock grommet to the FV's, to allow for 'mass production' of HM Wine which has rather mislead the current thinking of a 'newer' generation. They see the FV can take an air lock. They therefore assume it must need an air lock.

Completely untrue, of course

[Middo]

No disrespect, Middo, but; A few quid more could've bought ye a damn good 'Fish Tank Heater / Thermostat' combo job.

That'd keep ye beer at pretty much exactly 18 - 25F, or any degree between, above or below, which ye chose to set it at, with a twist or forefinger and thumb.

Those 'Brew Belt' things just seem to be so hit and miss. They need constant nannying and frigging about with. More art than science.

I wish I had read this before buying that belt - I checked the temperature last night and the beer was around 30C!
I've now turned it off for the day. Hopefully there won't be too much of an effect on the flavour

[scottmoss]

No disrespect, Middo, but; A few quid more could've bought ye a damn good 'Fish Tank Heater / Thermostat' combo job.

That'd keep ye beer at pretty much exactly 18 - 25F, or any degree between, above or below, which ye chose to set it at, with a twist or forefinger and thumb.

Those 'Brew Belt' things just seem to be so hit and miss. They need constant nannying and frigging about with. More art than science.

I wish I had read this before buying that belt - I checked the temperature last night and the beer was around 30C!
I've now turned it off for the day. Hopefully there won't be too much of an effect on the flavour

Have you tried moving the belt higher up your fv?

[Middo]

Have you tried moving the belt higher up your fv?

That's on my To-Do list - I've turned it off while I'm at work and will take a temperature reading when I get home. Then I'll move it up to halfway, rather than 4" from the bottom and take another temp reading. Hopefully I can find some sort of equilibrium and keep the temp between 20-24C.