Ice concentration
Re: Ice concentration
I think thats a myth spud, not illegal in the UK anyway.
@Jordan, check the blog in my siggie for info on the blueberry TC mate
@Jordan, check the blog in my siggie for info on the blueberry TC mate
Re: Ice concentration
Maybe so, I know it's illegal over here and presumed you guys were the same.
Re: Ice concentration
Any form of distilling in the UK is covered by HMRC laws. They currently state that stills must produce less than 5 litres and be for personal use. A licence should be obtained, telling them what you are making. It is otherwise illegal apparently.
Re: Ice concentration
Distillation and concentration are two completely different processes.
Distillation is the removal of alcohol spirits from the fermented substance, that’s how distillers get whisky from beer. Concentrating does not remove anything but water, so there is no real distillation going on.
Cribbed that from another site.
Barring local laws it's actually legal in the US too. Many microbreweries make an EisBock.
Thanks for the warning though.
Distillation is the removal of alcohol spirits from the fermented substance, that’s how distillers get whisky from beer. Concentrating does not remove anything but water, so there is no real distillation going on.
Cribbed that from another site.
Barring local laws it's actually legal in the US too. Many microbreweries make an EisBock.
Thanks for the warning though.
Re: Ice concentration
This is a discussion we have had many times before but I've yet to see a definitive answer.
I personally consider that it is a form of distillation but then I don't make the rules. Decent Wiki article here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeze_distillation
But before we get too carried away, perhaps we should reflect on this:
I personally consider that it is a form of distillation but then I don't make the rules. Decent Wiki article here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeze_distillation
But before we get too carried away, perhaps we should reflect on this:
jordanchaos wrote: the icejacked beer on its own is quite frankly 'orrid.
Re: Ice concentration
This discussion has been done before - Brewdog claim you do not need a license since it is beer and not spirit. On a technical level very hard to get right as you need exceptionally good beer to start with before freezing (this is the way eisbock is produced). I think mysterio had tried End of History and said it was revolting...Spud395 wrote:This is called freeze distilling and like other forms of distilation is illegal without a licence
A hydro will not work after you concentrate, and it's not as simple as a division for working out ABV IIRC.
Re: Ice concentration
The beer I made was really heavy and dark, its just too much, but a small amount added to each bottle adds massive body, its nice.However a super light lager may provide OK results (I don't think its ever going to be 'good') Cider however is a really really neat idea. The yanks have a history of Applejack.
Keiran, is 'Something Wicked' Inspired by British Sea Power?
Keiran, is 'Something Wicked' Inspired by British Sea Power?
Re: Ice concentration
hey jordan, your a scientist by trade? Whats the crack with some people going on about ice concentration of apple jack etc...producing methanols in higher quantities and ending up like stevie wonder after drinking it? Is that just a load of tosh or wot?
Re: Ice concentration
if were incredibly efficient with your concentration (far beyond what was easily available in the home- you'd need an ultrasonic bath for one), the original brew was indeed high in undesirable alcohols, if you are a strong willed and foolhardy drinker of spirits with a long established high tolerance to alcohol, you could FEASIBLY do yourself a mischief. Blinding is very unlikely from this, illness and hangover from hell and back, likely. Remember this is not a new idea, Eisbeer, AppleJack and even the Brewdog brewery have been there before.
As with anything let good sense be your guide. Skimming 50% water of a 10% cider is OK. Working tirelessly to produce a small amount of concentrate is foolish. I want to be part of a progressive brewing movement. If you want to get blind drunk on scotch that tastes awful just got to Lidl – its way less effort.
We need an “Experiment’s what we done†thread don’t we?
P.S I cant seem to find any kind of digital alcohol measuring device anywhere
As with anything let good sense be your guide. Skimming 50% water of a 10% cider is OK. Working tirelessly to produce a small amount of concentrate is foolish. I want to be part of a progressive brewing movement. If you want to get blind drunk on scotch that tastes awful just got to Lidl – its way less effort.
We need an “Experiment’s what we done†thread don’t we?
P.S I cant seem to find any kind of digital alcohol measuring device anywhere
Ice concentration
I quite enjoyed end of history, very warming, like a sweet cask strength whisky.
I was listening to a discussion on an old brewing network podcast yesterday, they were saying there still isn't enough methanol to do you any damage in a drink like applejack, but it is the concentrated methanol that gives you a stinking hangover!
Something wicked was just a quick description I could think up for my lambic, bearing in mind the risk I've taken in actually introducing spoiling microorganisms into my brewery!
---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=57.157436,-2.124131
I was listening to a discussion on an old brewing network podcast yesterday, they were saying there still isn't enough methanol to do you any damage in a drink like applejack, but it is the concentrated methanol that gives you a stinking hangover!
Something wicked was just a quick description I could think up for my lambic, bearing in mind the risk I've taken in actually introducing spoiling microorganisms into my brewery!
---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=57.157436,-2.124131
- Pinto
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Re: Ice concentration
Live your life according to "all things in moderation" and you wont go too far wrong.
Im thinking of trying to concentrate some of my forthcoming Imperial Stout, with a view to using it as "spirit" base for this year's Xmas pudding - way I see it, the methanol/fusels should only be a problem if I decided to use too much to concentrate - after all, if theres,say, 0.5% nasties in 2l of beer, the same quantity will be in 200ml of concentrate; issue comes when I decide to add 5 batches of concentrate together in a pint glass and try to drink it
Im thinking of trying to concentrate some of my forthcoming Imperial Stout, with a view to using it as "spirit" base for this year's Xmas pudding - way I see it, the methanol/fusels should only be a problem if I decided to use too much to concentrate - after all, if theres,say, 0.5% nasties in 2l of beer, the same quantity will be in 200ml of concentrate; issue comes when I decide to add 5 batches of concentrate together in a pint glass and try to drink it
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- dcq1974
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Re: Ice concentration
Yes sorry to be a party pooper but as far as I recall - this form of freeze distillation is as illegal as conventional distillation
Care with discussions Crafties
At least you won't blow yourselves up this way
Care with discussions Crafties
At least you won't blow yourselves up this way
Last edited by dcq1974 on Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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author in
Handbook of Alcoholic Beverages: Technical, Analytical and Nutritional Aspects, 2 Volume Set, 1204 pages, edited by Alan J Buglass
**OUT NOW**
To find out more and buy online, go to
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Re: Ice concentration
haha..illegal...legal....nobody seems to be able to agree on this. Someone email HMRC and ask! maybe i'll do it...
Re: Ice concentration
Interesting that no-one seems to know about the legality. You'd think that of all places a home brew forum would be where to find that sort of thing out. I've always assumed it to be illegal as I don't really see the difference between removing alcohol from a fermented drink and removing water. If you remove water, you're left with concentrated alcohol, so you've effectively removed alcohol from the water as well.
BTW, my understanding was that conventional (hot) distillation could lead to poisoning by unwanted alcohols because as the temperature of the liquid (and vapour) rises different fractions are boiled off. If you collect at the wrong temperature, you may end up catching all the nasty products and concentrating them with nasty consequences.
I don't know to what extent the same thing happens with freezing, but from the physics of it I can't see any reason why it would be much different. The details would depend on the freezing points of the various possible mixtures, but in principle you could end up concentrating the nasties in the same way. Much the same thing happens with rocks when magma cools (sorry, my daughter's a geologist) and that's how you end up with concentrations of different minerals.
So I'd say there's the potential for danger here.
BTW, my understanding was that conventional (hot) distillation could lead to poisoning by unwanted alcohols because as the temperature of the liquid (and vapour) rises different fractions are boiled off. If you collect at the wrong temperature, you may end up catching all the nasty products and concentrating them with nasty consequences.
I don't know to what extent the same thing happens with freezing, but from the physics of it I can't see any reason why it would be much different. The details would depend on the freezing points of the various possible mixtures, but in principle you could end up concentrating the nasties in the same way. Much the same thing happens with rocks when magma cools (sorry, my daughter's a geologist) and that's how you end up with concentrations of different minerals.
So I'd say there's the potential for danger here.