How to use bitter orange peel and coriander

[BarryNL]

I'm planning on brewing a Belgian style strong triple but with orange and coriander flavouring. I have some dried bitter orange peel and some coriander seeds but have not used these before. Does anyone have advice on how to use these in a recipe - i.e. when to add to the boil and how much to use (for, say 20 litres). I'd like both flavours to be relatively subtle but not undetectable.

[Edwin Thrunge]

Look here for this recipe:

viewtopic.php?t=15974&highlight=wits+end

Rob.

[mysterio]

Use them at the end of the boil as with aroma hops, or in the last minute or two.

Coriander, depends on the freshness. Even whole coriander can lose its potency when not stored correctly. 14g will give you a noticeable coriander aroma, without being overpowering. 5 - 10g would be more of a background note. I think it gives a zesty, lemon/lime aroma when used at these smaller levels. Crush before use.

If you're using the grey curacao orange peel stuff you get at homebrew shops, you can use around 30g of this and still not get much from it. Fresh citrus peel works better, at similar quantities.

Incidently commercial tripels don't tend to be spiced, the exception I can think of is Delerium Tremens. Not sure if you call this a Tripel but it's close.

[bconnery]

Some info I found on line on belgian styles suggests the following for wit with regards to spice levels and boil times. I've only made one wit and the spice levels seemed ok but that's about the extent of my testing of this advice...

"Coriander in the boil is essential: use 1 gram or more per liter of finished beer, boiled for 5 minutes or so. Coarsely ground whole coriander and boils over 15 minutes result in low coriander flavor. Curaao (bitter) orange peel is also traditional, in amounts between 0.5 and 1 gram/liter. The peel can be boiled for longer if desired, up to about 1/2 hour. It contributes a rich herbal flavor similar to herb tea, and does not taste of orange."
It also suggests this in terms of the boil for the orange...Your plan to use bitter orange peel is fine, but if this is correct you may want to give it a few minutes more...
"Ham aroma. Many white beers have an orangey flavor from the coriander, some brewers use orange instead. Boiling Sunkist type orange peels and especially commercial dried peels imparts a ham-like aroma. Bitter orange can do this too, particularly when boiled for just a short period. Citrus zest can be used without too many problems."

[smp465]

I didn't get the effect i thought i would from dried orange, but reading this i might have under dosed anyway! If you use peel from fresh fruit, do you use all the peel, i.e. all that you might peel off to eat an orange say, pith and all, or do you just grate off the zest and use that?

Cheers

[mysterio]

Not the pith, just the zest. A little pith wont hurt - a quick way to do it is to use a potato peeler or sharp grater.

[BarryNL]

Well, I went with 20g dried orange peel for 10 mins and 12g crushed coriander seeds for 5 mins. Certainly neither flavour is particularly strong in the wort (which is 1.082 and so tastes pretty much of sugar). It will be interesting to see how it turns out. It's now sitting at 18deg.C with two packets of T-58.

mysterio: Yes, I didn't want to make just a simple tripel - my favourites are things like Westmalle which have a bit of a spicy flavour to them - many other tripels I find a bit bland, hence my desire to make something between a tripel and something like a Hoegaarden Grand Cru. Time will tell if I have achieved this. The rest of the ingredients are (from memory).

3.7kg Pils malt.
1.0kg Pale malt.
80g Aromatic malt.
1kg white sugar
100g Brown sugar
Mash 90 mins @ 66deg.C

90 mins boil
70g Tettnanger @ 60 mins
25g Saaz @ 10 mins
20g orange peel @ 10 mins
12g crushed coriander seed @ 5 mins
Irish moss and yeast nutrient to taste.
T-58 yeast

for 19L brew

[pantsmachine]

I added a pack of brupacks dried curaco orange peel(100GRMS) to a hefeweisen 2 weeks ago, whole pack went in for the boil, could taste it at the beginning of the barrel. Blended in now though. That's the grey dried out peel. When i use it again i will restricty its boil time to last 20 i think as big orange aroma at the start that faded away to nothing by the end of the boil. I can still taste the peel in the hefeweisen, good luck with your experimentation.