Saison Critique Pls

[weiht]

Planning to brew something i have not tried before, but the problem is I dont have any commercial examples that i can use as a reference here.

23L 75% Eff.
4.2 kg Pilsner Malt
500g Maris Otter (A local Brewer told me he uses some MO for his Belgians)
500g Cane Suga
350g Munich
200g Wheat
200g victory
60g Special B

60g Hallertau 60mins
25g Styrian Goldings 15mins

OG - 1061
IBU - 31

Using WLP568, approx attenuation at 76%... Still a high FG at 1015, should i transfer to a secondary and finish it with a champagne yeast? I see ppl's FG well below 1010... TIA

[coatesg]

I'd drop the victory myself and up the Munich. You can also use more wheat than that if you wish - I last went for 7% each munich, wheat and sugar with the rest pilsner malt. I could have dropped the pilsner amount too. Either way, I think you want the beer to finish as dry as possible (under 1010 is what you should be aiming for - even lower if possible (I got a saison from 1062 to 1002 inside of 2 weeks with Wy3711...).

Hopping seem fine - Anything with Hallertau, Styrians, Goldings, or Saaz in pretty much any combination is fine. You can have late and dry hops too if you really fancy it - they can be quite hop-forward (and often a little citrusy).

One note is that from 1061 if you get it really dry, you'll be looking at a 7%+ beer which is at the strong end of saisons. No problem with that, but if you want to drop some pils and shoot for a 5-6% it will probably get to a low enough FG a little easier. Champagne yeast later is another option, yes.

[richc]

My one and only Saison that was pretty successful had 4kg Pilsner, 1kg Munich, 200g Acidulated and 100g wheat. The acidulated was to add a touch of sour which was only just noticeable in the end. I used WLB 565 which only got me to 1.010 (from 1.063), I have heard some interesting things about 565 since using it and think 568 might be a better choice of yeast.
One interesting tip I've picked up from several places is that fermenting saisons pretty warm is a good idea. I ramped the temperature from 20 to 28C over 10 days but have heard of people fermenting a fair bit warmer than that,

[weiht]

went for this instead

4kg Pilsner
500g MO
500g Munich Light
250g Wheat
60g Special B
350g Sugar (Miscaculated)

Mashed at 64c to make more fermentable.. Pitched at 20c held for 1st 24hrs, raised to 21c over next 24hrs before letting i go to 28c or higher.. Started at 1056, and its now 1018 40 hrs in... WLP568 works hard and fast, very nice smell now, had a taste and its got a nice belgian yeast thing going on..

[weiht]

wow its hit 1010 today, and its holding at 25c... thats 80% attenuation alr from the wlp568... I plan to let it free raise to 28c for 1 more day just to let the yeast finish up n clean up some of the acetaldehyde i tasted in the sample and whatever thats left there...

After that I will start to drop the temperature to 8c for 2 days or so before i rack it to the keg for conditioning... How long do u guy reckon it shld age before serving??? Its my first saison, so im not familiar

[weiht]

Edit, deleted duplicate post

[coatesg]

I'd give it another few days yet - four days isn't very long in the fermenter. Let it finish up naturally at 25C - you might get it somewhat drier yet. I didn't age mine much before serving - 3 to 4 weeks perhaps?

[weiht]

Currently holding at 26c, and I'm seriously thinking whether to raise it further or just hold it here... I read ppl raising it all the way to 30c but that's for the dupont strain... I chill a sample and it tasted spicy n nice, but I preferred some more esters n I think I hopped it a little high... Definitely gg for mid 20s ibu next time

[Barley Water]

If you raise the temperature now it may help you attenuate a bit more but you will likely not get any more yeast character than you currently have. Most yeasts will throw off all the goodies when they are in the lag phase, that's when they are muliplying just before they actually start making beer (that's why you get away with doing a diacety rest when making lagers, the yeast has already multiplied). You can get those Saison strains really hot and not cause yourself any problems, supposidly they are related to wine yeasts which makes sense since that style comes from the area very close to France. I have not used the strain you used as I rather like the Dupont strain although it is pretty wierd stuff. I also recently made a Saison but mine won't be ready for about 6 months or so since I spiked mine with Brett B, it will be interesting to see how that come out.

[weiht]

Kegging this tomorrow as the fg is stable at 1006... Tasted it and it's a little in the high side for bitterness I think, and fermenting at 20c for first 40hrs resulted in a lack of esters... Will start at 21c instead and raise it after 24hrs next time..