To Convert a Lager-holic.

[Askari Joe]

Here's what I did in the end...

Benonite APA

Beer Style: American IPA

Malt & Fermentables:
% Kg Malt or Fermentable
53% 3.000 Lager Malt
36% 2.000 Pale Malt (Maris Otter)
9% 0.500 Maize, Flaked (Thomas Fawcett)
2% 0.120 Wheat, Torrified

Batch Size: 23.0 liters

OG: 1.054 Measured (1.057 estimated)

Color: 9° EBC (Yellow)

Hops:
boil 60 mins 20 Cascade 7.9
boil 30 mins 10 Chinook 13.3
boil 30 mins 10 Citra 11.6
boil 15 mins 7 Cascade 7.9
boil 15 mins 7 Chinook 13.3
boil 15 mins 7 Citra 13.8

Bitterness: 47.1 IBU

Yeast: Safale US-05 Dry Yeast

Alcohol: Estimated at 5.2% ABV

It's now fermenting nicely and smells amazing! Not sure if it'll win Gary over, but I'm happy!

Cheers for all your advice... Now I'm thinking of brewing a Saison.

[Barley Water]

Well I have some good news for the Saison lovers out there. I have a decent recipe I have made a few times (with some tweeking). My only real issue with the stuff was that I could not get it to dry out as much as I would like. Anyway, since my formulation is meant to be a throwback to when the farmers making the stuff didn't know much about sanitation, I chucked in a vial of Brett B at bottling (and I put the stuff up in Champagne bottles with cages and corks so I could carbonate the hell out of it). I am happy to report that after about 6 months or so in the bottles, the little beasties are doing what I had hoped they would and are drying the stuff out nicely and adding a bit of funk which is not unwelcome. I have put the beer in a really big contest we are running over here (1,800+ entries across all styles, a real bitch to judge) so it will be interesting to see what comments I get back on the score sheets. If you decide to go this route, just be careful not to let the bugs get into your regular beer equipment otherwise, how do you say "house flavor"?

[critch]

corn is a flavour I really don't like in beer. There are a million different things I would use to thin out a beer or add another layer of flavour before I reached for that stuff. I can understand why it's used in some American styles, especially the historical ones, but I personally don't like the note it brings, and I reckon our British malts are good enough that things like corn and rice only serve to spoil the flavour.

damn right! corn is for tortilla's

our local regional is useing more and more corn syrup in its beers and they are fekkin disgraceful now, bout 10 years ago they were damn good, a breweries in sh!t when the bean counters take over, if i wanted to thin and dry it out id use sugar, but personally i rarely do

must say though weve got very experimental brewers over here just look at some of gary smiffs recipes......

[Askari Joe]

I had to try it just so I'd know. If I left it out I'd always be wondering.

Tortillas.... mmmm.

[redpola]

Not a homebrewey suggestion, but the Czechs have a fairly well-defined path from lagers to ales via their polotmavy lezak beers, which are lagered beers but with much more oomph than normal using darker malt.

Having said that, to a British lager (wee wee) drinker, Czech lager beers are quite tasty anyway.

Example beer: Bernard Special Ox [URL]http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/bernard-po ... 11o/19803/[/URL]

I've surprised many a lager drinker with this stuff and to my mind it's much nearer an ale than a lager. At least this should get them to the cliff edge if not push them over. :)

[Askari Joe]

Not a homebrewey suggestion, but the Czechs have a fairly well-defined path from lagers to ales via their polotmavy lezak beers, which are lagered beers but with much more oomph than normal using darker malt.

Having said that, to a British lager (wee wee) drinker, Czech lager beers are quite tasty anyway.

Example beer: Bernard Special Ox http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/bernard-po ... 11o/19803/

I've surprised many a lager drinker with this stuff and to my mind it's much nearer an ale than a lager. At least this should get them to the cliff edge if not push them over.

Oh heck yeah, Czech lagers are great. And there's plenty of other great lagers (or pilsners for the purists) out there. When I started this thread though I had Carling and Fosters in mind. You know, pasturisted, artificially carbonated and served at a temperature to avoid tasting how void of flavour it is. I do like a good proper pilsner though, also Samuel Adams Boston lager is amazing as it Brooklyn Lager. Don't know if I've just opened a powder keg...

[Laripu]

I just read this thread with some interest and felt I had to offer something.

First of all, I agree with Mr Barley Water on what constitutes a good starter ale. I like his formulation, which was 1.050, 20-25 BU, light yellow colour stemming from pale malt (or even lager malt), & some light crystal. I would go with 25 BU, because you do want the lager drinker to notice some difference.... but that's a mere quibble.

I have no objection to the use of some flaked maize. I agree that it imparts a light grainy flavour. You might say "oh, that's an American thing", but if you look into the old books by Dave Line, you'll see that he used it for a significant number of British ales. It's nice when used in moderation, that is to say < 20% of fermentables, probably better at 10%.

Nottingham is a good yeast for this beer. It's cold-tolerant for an ale yeast, and I'd ferment it at 58 to 60°F, no warmer. (That's 15°C.) You'll get a lager-like ale. A bit more fruitiness, and bit more hop expression - just enough to impress, but not scare off Mr LagerLout.

Where I take issue with Mr Barley Water is on the appelation "American Pale Ale" to this beer style. This was (prior to the 1980's) Canada's dominant beer style, and hardly ever drunk in the United States, where lagers have ruled since before Prohibition. They still have at least two popular examples: Molson Export Ale (which Canadians refer to as "Ex"), and Labatt 50 Ale, (aka "50"). In fact, Molson is the oldest continuously operating brewery in North America, despite the fact that Yuengling won a lawsuit allowing them to call themselves the oldest brewery in America. This style should be called Canadian Golden Ale.

I'm not arguing that these are great beers, just that they are a distinct style made popular in Canada, where they are still in wide use. (For example, there's a newish brand, Lug Tread, from Vankleek Hill, a small farming area between Montreal and Ottawa. Another fine example is Griffon Extra Pale.)

For lager drinkers, they are a perfect segue into the ale world. The first beer I ever had, at a McGill University "beer bash" (I snuck in, because I was only 15) was Labatt 50. I soon switched to Molson Ex, which smelled and tasted better to me. I have some nostalgic feelings for this style, and I drink Canadian Golden Ale whenever I vacation there. I suspect that your summer ale style is similar.