Hefeweizen - Cloudy Frog & Cloudy Fruity Frog

[Kev888]

Well a few of you have kindly helped me bumble towards trying my first hefe, so here's what I'm thinking so far, planned for next weekend. Basically I'm intending to make a full batch of straight hefe and then drain half to the FV and add some Citra to the remainder for an experimental fruity and hopefully even more summery version:

Cloudy Frog - 85L brew Length:
60% (13250g) Wheat Malt
30% (6620g) Pils (or Lager) malt
10% (2200g) Munich Malt
250g Hallertauer Hersbrucker 90 mins - 23 IBUs
50g Hallertauer Hersbrucker 15 mins - 2 IBUs
Yeast WLP300 - how much - 2L starter?
Expected OG 1055, expected ABV 5.5%, total IBUs 25
(am assuming lower efficiency for wheat say 70% instead of usual 75% brew-house

Cloudy Fruity Frog - 42L brew Length:
take half of above brew and add:
40g Citra 15mins - 15 IBUs
60g Citra 0mins (80c steep) - 0 IBUs
Yeast WLP300
Total IBUs (including previous Hallertauer) 40 IBUs

I'm intending to do a single infusion mash for this one (maybe i'll try steps/rests in the future if it seems needed). I understand stressing the yeast a little by underpitching may be worthwhile - any suggestions on how much?

An other thoughts/comments would also be much appreciated - the hefe is new to me (though probably fairly standard), and the citra is doubly so as I've not used that before either..

Cheers
Kev

[Zapp Brannigan]

Wow, those are some seriuos quantities!

The grain bill etc looks good. The only comment I would make is that your IBUs are high for the style - weizen is all about the malt.

My stock weizen is brewed to 12-13 IBUs and my Dunkelweizen is brewed to 15. Both use Hersbrucker.

Hope it goes well for you, hefeweizen is such a fantastic style

[Kev888]

Ha, yes - I've not had much chance to brew lately and have run out of beer thats ready, so am replenishing the stocks - it is going to be split in half too, of course so i should get two cornies of each and a bit spare for eventualities. Its a long time since I've made anything actually nasty (thankfully) so whilst hopes for my first attempt at a hefe aren't too high, I am at least banking on it being drinkable..

Ah, thank you very much for the hopping suggestion. Guess I'm more used to IPAs for pale beers so it seemed modest by comparison, but on reflection you could well have a point. I would like this first one to be 'reasonably' authentic (at least the non-citra half) and I'm also partially brewing it with some friends in mind who aren't hop-heads.

If I go with 150g at 90mins (instead of 250g) then that should give me about 13 IBUs, and if I add 50g at flameout instead of 15mins that'll add a bit of aroma but less hop flavour or bitterness (and still make use of the remainder of the opened pack). So that would then be:

Cloudy Frog - 85L brew Length:
60% (13250g) Wheat Malt
30% (6620g) Pils (or Lager) malt
10% (2200g) Munich Malt
150g Hallertauer Hersbrucker 90 mins - 13 IBUs
50g Hallertauer Hersbrucker 0 mins - 0 IBUs
Yeast WLP300 - how much - 2L starter?
Expected OG 1055, expected ABV 5.5%, total IBUs 13
(am assuming lower efficiency for wheat say 70% instead of usual 75% brew-house

Cloudy Fruity Frog - 42L brew Length:
take half of above brew and add:
40g Citra 15mins - 15 IBUs
60g Citra 0mins (80c steep) - 0 IBUs
Yeast WLP300
Total IBUs (including previous Hallertauer) 27 IBUs

Hows that sounding to people - any thoughts/other-thoughts?

Cheers
Kev

[Beer O'Clock]

While doing some research on Munich the other night I discovered that Scneider-Weisse do a Hopfenweisse. It sounds interesting, described as;

" Hoppy fireworks - a new wheat beer style.

The ideal companion to very spicy and exotic dishes.

Wheat doppelbock 8,2% vol. alc., original gravity: 18,5% ".

No indication of IBUs though. Guess I will have to go and try it to find out.

[Kev888]

Hmm, sounds potential - could a lighter alternative to winter brews too..
In this case I'm looking for a light summer alternative to my usual IPAs though, so perhaps thats one for later in the year..

Cheers
kev

[Beer O'Clock]

I like the look of your revised Hefe (obviously at a more sensible brew length).

I may try a "detuned" Hopfenweisse (5%) myself after I have a go at the standard style.
Then I can go to Munich as an excuse to compare.

[leedsbrew]

Good work on remembering to lower your efficiency! I totally forgotten yesterday, but still managed 78% IIRC! I didn't notice the IBU's fret time of reading, but you definitely better with that revised hop schedule if your aiming for something closer 'to style'! Looks good man!

I would say that all my hefe brews have been better from a bottle that the few I have kegged!

[Kev888]

Thanks chaps, thats reassuring! Think i'll order the ingredients then.

Ah bottling; I remember growing to hate that... although actually in this case perhaps its worth persevering; I'm a bit short on cornies and would also like to take some for friends to sample, so if bottling works better too.. Maybe I'll keg one cornie of each variant and bottle the rest. I know they're large volumes but i'm hoping it'll last me for ages..

LB, I see you used 0.5L of wlp300 starter in your recent 22L brew. Would you say thats about the right rate for this brew (if scaled up)?

Cheers
Kev

[leedsbrew]

It's worked well for te last 2 hefes kev, giving them a nice balance between ester and phenolic flavours. I ferment mine warmer (20-22) as I believe this weights it more to the banana esters, which I love in Weissbier! At that pitching rate you shouldnt have any problems so long as your starter has fermented out! yesterday's was chuggig away nicely this aft with a good 10mm if krausen! In fact I reckon I'll be able to crop some off the top by either tomorrow morning of evening! It really is a bonkers yeast! I'm planning to reuse the cropped yeast for a dunkelweiss, followed by a weizenbock! ( I have a fair bit of wheat malt to use up! Lol)

[leedsbrew]

Oh, I also chilled the wort down to 15oC so as to stress the little buggers a bit more during early fermentation. When I left to go to work this evening the fermentation temp was 18.6oC so just a bit over the '30' rule (traditional rule of thumb for weiss that pitching and ferm temp should add up to 30) not that I was aiming for that, just a happy accident.! It should get up to 20oC by the time I'm home.

[Kev888]

Excellent, many thanks! I didn't know about the rule of thumb for temperatures either so thats useful - sounds easy enough really, if I remember to do it.

I'm good to go now then, just need to get the ingredients and try to reserve a day next weekend .

I've been doing more yeast harvesting recently, it really does seem to be the way to go for me when possible. Sounds like this one may be ideal for that - i'm really looking forward to trying it!

Cheers
kev

[Zapp Brannigan]

No reason to doubt that it will be a good hefe, the recipe looks spot on for the style with the revised IBUs

Incidentally, whereabouts in the East Mids are you Kev888? I'm in Rushden, Northants.

[Kev888]

Thanks for that, good stuff!. Just need to order some of the hops and should be ready for next weekend now - though there are mounting pressures on me to be elsewhere (grrr).

I'm up in the north of the region myself, based near Derby, but also floating around Loughborough and Ilkeston areas. Not that it matters much perhaps, as I seem to be spending almost every waking hour at work these days <sigh>. Anyway, I'm hoping my bigger brew lengths will make up for the increasingly infrequent brew days, and that splitting them between different hops and so on will maintain some variety even with fewer brews, but so far its not been enough - perhaps I need more cornies..

Cheers
kev

[simco999]

Wow - they are serious brew lengths - we are not worthy!!!!

[Kev888]

Well it seemed a lot initially, but its funny how quickly that wears off - in practice brew days are pretty much business as usual (except everythings just that bit more inconvenient and cumbersome) really. But I'm not brewing (or drinking) more beer than before, just brewing less often, so I'm struggling a bit for storage capacity between batches at the mo. This isn't necessarily ideal, especially for variety and experimentation, its more a way to keep brewing enjoyable and keep beer on tap even though I'm getting less time to spend on it - less time but still quality time when it happens.

Cheers
kev