Dark Ale

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Northern Brewer
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Re: Dark Ale

Post by Northern Brewer » Thu Dec 12, 2019 3:33 pm

PeeBee wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 3:12 am
Northern Brewer wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:45 pm
… Not all Belgian yeasts came from Scotland, but specifically Duvel uses a strain (formerly two) that originated in a bottle from Mcewans, harvested by the great brewing scientist Jean De Clerck between the wars. …
Further to my suggestion that Belgium yeasts came from Scotland: I dug this up from Ron Pattinson's "Guide to Vintage Beers":
Pg134, 1928 Usher Old Scotch Ale, "One of the Scotch ales exported to Belgium --- helped shape the Belgian style".
That's the style of Belgian Scotch ale, not all Belgian beers. Sure, there was lots of cultural exchange between the UK and Belgium in the aftermath of WWI - not least through battlefield tourism etc - but British yeasts represent only a small proportion of all yeast used in Belgium. After all, one of the main ways to create a new style is to try and clone a "foreign" style with the ingredients you have to hand - so West Coast IPAs were trying to make British IPAs with clean American yeasts, people in Cologne and elsewhere made lagers with their local ale yeasts and so on.

The Belhaven Wee Heavy has a direct link to Fowler's Twelve Guineas, as it was contract-brewed at Heriot brewery where George Howell worked before becoming head brewer at Belhaven. Belhaven subsequently contract-brewed Twelve Guineas before InBev killed it, so they wanted to keep the tradition going.

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PeeBee
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Re: Dark Ale

Post by PeeBee » Sat Dec 14, 2019 2:48 pm

Northern Brewer wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 3:33 pm
… That's the style of Belgian Scotch ale, not all Belgian beers. …
Okay, my turn!

I've probably accepted "wee heavy" does not describe a beer; though "Scotch ale" is probably as bad as saying "wee heavy". But I get the impression Scottish folk encouraged the use of "Scotch" as it helped sell stuff across the border. On the grounds of (for example): "You can call it Scotch and buy plenty of it; but call me Scotch when you mean Scottish and I'll bang yer lights out!".

"Scottish strong ale" would be more grammatically correct.

Not really criticism, I've really appreciated the clarifications from the thread.

~~~~~~~~~~~

I get the impression "Burton Ale", "Scottish strong ale" (e.g. Edinburgh Ales) and "Belgium strong ales" (e.g. Belgium Abbey ales) all are cut from the same cloth? Would explain why nearly all my favourite beer types come under those headings.

I dug this out and found it well interesting. Okay, it's Wikipedia and I know you have to be careful with the facts you uncover from there, but the article looks like its the product of plenty of hard work and research (check the references). Only one rather minor bit I could disagree with: Burton ale is dark. Darker than pale ales perhaps? And I do prefer them dark myself, using them to try all sorts of "unusual" dark malts (like pale chocolate malt I used in the recipe earlier in this thread).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burton_Ale
It even suggests Fuller's ESB derives from the "Burton" type. That would mean all three beers I have on for this Christmas are "Burton ale" types or clones of "Burton Ale" types.
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."

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Northern Brewer
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Re: Dark Ale

Post by Northern Brewer » Sat Dec 14, 2019 7:54 pm

PeeBee wrote:
Sat Dec 14, 2019 2:48 pm
I get the impression "Burton Ale", "Scottish strong ale" (e.g. Edinburgh Ales) and "Belgium strong ales" (e.g. Belgium Abbey ales) all are cut from the same cloth? Would explain why nearly all my favourite beer types come under those headings.

I dug this out and found it well interesting. Okay, it's Wikipedia and I know you have to be careful with the facts you uncover from there, but the article looks like its the product of plenty of hard work and research (check the references). Only one rather minor bit I could disagree with: Burton ale is dark. Darker than pale ales perhaps?
Variable, but the average is definitely on the darker side of brown I'd say.

Some of the Edinburgh beers were definitely inspired by Burton ales, but the link to Belgium is much looser - they had their own traditions of brewing strong beers going back to medieval times, long before Scotland was exporting beer. So it's more a question of them experiencing exported bottles and then letting that influence them in different ways - some will be heavily influenced, others will ignore them totally.

As an aside, this is the newish BJCP classification for those who like such things :
https://dev.bjcp.org/beer-styles/17a-br ... urton-ale/

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Re: Dark Ale

Post by PeeBee » Sat Dec 21, 2019 1:57 pm

wezzel01 wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 7:45 pm
Thanks PeeBee, that’s very helpful.

All the brews I’m considering are fairly similar but I’ll have a go at yours this time. …
Did you give it a go? Did you add the oak chips? Mine is on pump now (no oak), but might benefit from another week or so (round off the "roast" notes - there's not much as it was pale chocolate malt, but I know it will polish up a bit more).
20191220_213030_WEB.jpg
It's the one in the tall glass, although they all look much the same. "Nyrs Gron" (ABV 5.8%) I call it, a local landmark ("nyrs" is Welsh spelling for English word "nurse"). The one in the champagne glass is also a "Burton Ale" type, a Fuller's 1845 clone (I call it 1877, ABV 7.2%), a more refined and stronger Burton Ale but needs 3 months maturing to reach prime condition so I didn't detail that one. The one in the dimple glass is a Fuller's ESB clone ("Mynydd Mynyllod" ABV 6.1; bet you can't pronounce that!). All my beers come out a bit strong at the moment because I've returned to my old brewing kit but not tweaked the expected efficiency in the recipe builder.

I was getting a bit Christmassy with the camera!
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."

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alexlark
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Re: Dark Ale

Post by alexlark » Sat Dec 21, 2019 3:05 pm

Certainly looks good PeeBee!

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Dark Ale

Post by wezzel01 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:03 am

I never got around to ordering oak chips and, with the pressure of Christmas looming, I ended up making a batch of Sarah Hughes Dark Ruby Mild and a batch of Old Peculier.

The OP was kegged yesterday and seems very smooth from an Initial taste. I put half a tin of black treacle in as usual. It was fermented using trub from the Ruby mild and took off like a rocket.

The Ruby Mild is lovely already (only been in the cornie for 3 weeks). I have bottled some too so I can leave it for a few months to mature.

Both brews used Wyeast 1968 and both are around 6%

Happy days


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