All Grain Starter Kit

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Zammo

All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Zammo » Tue Feb 07, 2017 3:32 pm

Hi all

Me and a friend have decided to give all grain brewing a go, I've been researching kit on the Internet and also using the Home Brew Beer book written by Greg Hughes and I've narrowed down my choice to this starter kit:


http://www.allgraingarage.co.uk/product-page/bitter

Has anyone any experience with this? Also it use an electric boiler and I was wondering if its OK to use a Wort Chiller with it? I intend to get one made to the correct dimensions off of a person advertising on ebay.

Also the all grain starter kit doesn't actually have all the equipment we'd need to start brewing and I've attempted to create a list of all the basic additional gear we'd need. If anyone can see any glaring omissions please let me know!


Required Kit:
All Grain Starter Kit (Contains: Mash Tun 35L, Boiler 35L, Fermenter 26L, Connectors and Tubing, Hydrometer, Mash Paddle, Stirrer, Sterilizer, Beer Kit)
Buckingham 19 Ltr Steel Pot
or
Cool Box 35Ltr
Wort Chiller
Trial Jar
Pressure Barrel
Siphon
Ph Paper
Intermediate Vessel (1 Ltr Jug)
Hop Bag



In the list I've added a choice between getting a Buckingham 19 Ltr Steel Pot or a Cool Box. These would be used for the sparge water, which would either be boiled in the pot or boiled in the electric boiler and then put in the cool box until its required. Not really sure which is the best choice tbh.

Thanks.

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mozza
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by mozza » Tue Feb 07, 2017 4:23 pm

Zammo wrote:Hi all

Me and a friend have decided to give all grain brewing a go, I've been researching kit on the Internet and also using the Home Brew Beer book written by Greg Hughes and I've narrowed down my choice to this starter kit:


http://www.allgraingarage.co.uk/product-page/bitter

Has anyone any experience with this? Also it use an electric boiler and I was wondering if its OK to use a Wort Chiller with it? I intend to get one made to the correct dimensions off of a person advertising on ebay.

Also the all grain starter kit doesn't actually have all the equipment we'd need to start brewing and I've attempted to create a list of all the basic additional gear we'd need. If anyone can see any glaring omissions please let me know!


Required Kit:
All Grain Starter Kit (Contains: Mash Tun 35L, Boiler 35L, Fermenter 26L, Connectors and Tubing, Hydrometer, Mash Paddle, Stirrer, Sterilizer, Beer Kit)
Buckingham 19 Ltr Steel Pot
or
Cool Box 35Ltr
Wort Chiller
Trial Jar
Pressure Barrel
Siphon
Ph Paper
Intermediate Vessel (1 Ltr Jug)
Hop Bag



In the list I've added a choice between getting a Buckingham 19 Ltr Steel Pot or a Cool Box. These would be used for the sparge water, which would either be boiled in the pot or boiled in the electric boiler and then put in the cool box until its required. Not really sure which is the best choice tbh.

Thanks.
The kit looks like good value for money if you're not that DIY orientated. For starting out I'd recommend a mango chutney barrel and turn it into a boiler with a couple of kettle elements.

You can save some pennies and forget having a HLT for sparge water. Just use your boiler to heat the water to strike temp and then transfer to your mash tun and dough in. Whilst your grains are mashing, refil your boiler with the required amount of sparge water and away you go :) collect all the wort in a fermenting bucket and the pour back into the boiler.
Cheers and gone,

Mozza

Zammo

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Zammo » Tue Feb 07, 2017 4:43 pm

Thanks for the reply, I'm definitely not DIY orientated enough to know how to create a boiler, plus I'm a bit accident prone so don't like the idea of having to move a lot of boiling water around without the use of taps and tubing (which the pre-made kit has). Good to know I don't have to bother with a HLT or cooler box though, that'll save a bit of cash.

Fil
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Fil » Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:56 am

@Zammo go with what your comfortable with, but it might be worth an evenings google/utube on the subject of diy brewery making as the only skills needed are the ability to drill a hole tighten a nut and wire a plug.
You can go uber-gheto and repurpose £5 budget kettle elements, or spend a bit more on off the shelf elements complete with kettle lead sockets.. So a 50l boil kettle made from a mango barrel could cost as little as £20, and they work a treat ;) even tho the hdpe will soften a little over 80c (not a problem but a feature ..)

you might want to check out the copper kettle online brewshop they sell PP buckets suitable for diy boiler making and iirc will drill tap and element holes foc, they also sell elements n taps too.

looking at the link, im not convinced the tun included is such a good option, it looks like a £2 waterbutt tap fitted, and if secured with compression squeezing the inner and outer skin without a strengthening block its bound to leak, and probably slowley so you first find out when you brew short and clean up hearing it sloshing between the skins, and that will go manky and smelly very quickly.. Most successful cold box mash tun builds form a seal with the inner skin alone when no built in drain facility is inculded like the top end coleman series.
Cheaper cold boxes tend to have thin polystyrene sheets between the inner and outer skin and this provides no stability to make a seal against. No problem using a foodsafe waterbutt tap but the double skin fix wont last!!


the boiler looks like an ace boiler which you can buy on ebay for about £80, if you want an off the shelf boiler Ace users seem to like em on the whole, i would suggest a 40l buffalo boiler may be worth a look too.

all in all i wouldnt buy that particular kit, i would suggest a 40l buffalo and a grain bag may be a better value first kit investment. Especially with 2 of you to oik out the grain bag ;)
ist update for months n months..
Fermnting: not a lot..
Conditioning: nowt
Maturing: Challenger smash, and a kit lager
Drinking: dry one minikeg left in the store
Coming Soon Lots planned for the near future nowt for the immediate :(

robbym123
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Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:22 am

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by robbym123 » Wed Feb 08, 2017 8:54 am

My only suggestion would be that you consider Brew In A Bag (BIAB) before making a final decision.

For less money you could end up with the capacity to make more beer. Noting that you would be brewing with a buddy, i'm sure you would soon get fed up with a brew day only yielding 20 bottles each.

Take a look at somewhere like home brew builder. They do a 70l stainless pot for £70, they will cut the holes for you for installation of elements and tap (for £5/hole). I make it £160, all in, for a pot, 3 holes, 2 elements and a tap kit.

The only other kit you would need is a biab bag, good quality one about £25.

The other benefit of this approach would be that you could still use this pot as part of a 70l 3 vessel system - if you decided on this route in the future.

Also, being only one pot it is easier to clean and store after brew day.

With this kit, you would easily be able to make 80 bottles per batch. I have a similar set up, but 100l pot and regularly make 120 bottles, but have squeezed 200 bottles out of a brew.

Zammo

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Zammo » Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:53 am

Thanks for the replies.

robbym123 I don't really want to go the route of the BIAB brewing, we're both keen to do all grain brewing even if the yield isn't as much.

Fil, I'm a bit concerned that you think that the mash tun will end up leaking and getting water caught between the skins.

Here's a more fuller description of that mash tun (and photos), not sure if you can glean anymore info from it?
http://www.allgraingarage.co.uk/product ... m-mash-tun


Has anyone any idea where we could get another one which wouldn't have these issues and which also has sparge arm and integrated filter?

Zammo

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Zammo » Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:10 pm

As an update to this I emailed the maker of the mash tun and asked if there was any prevention from stopping it leaking or wort getting between the skins and they replied with this:

There are two neoprene barriers, one on each side of the skins. These along with the tight fitting threads ensure that no leakage happens.

chefgage
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by chefgage » Wed Feb 08, 2017 3:20 pm

Zammo wrote:Thanks for the replies.

robbym123 I don't really want to go the route of the BIAB brewing, we're both keen to do all grain brewing even if the yield isn't as much.
Just a quick point to add, BIAB is still brewing the all grain method.

Fil
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Fil » Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:14 am

Zammo wrote:Thanks for the replies.

robbym123 I don't really want to go the route of the BIAB brewing, we're both keen to do all grain brewing even if the yield isn't as much.

Fil, I'm a bit concerned that you think that the mash tun will end up leaking and getting water caught between the skins.

Here's a more fuller description of that mash tun (and photos), not sure if you can glean anymore info from it?
http://www.allgraingarage.co.uk/product ... m-mash-tun


Has anyone any idea where we could get another one which wouldn't have these issues and which also has sparge arm and integrated filter?
Sorry to be a negative nelly but i checked out the pics in the link and its not done a lot to change my impression,
Unless spending significantly more on a coldbox you are very unlikely to get something with moulded insulation filling the void between inner and outer skins and much more likely to find a thin sheet of similar shaped insulation occupying a proportion of the inner void. And such a construction will not hold a secure seal when attempted with a compression fitting between the two skins, the air in the void will simply give.

there have been a few runs of 'bargain' tuns on ebay over the years built in a similar fashion and many owners ended up in forums looking for solutions.

I could be wrong, but a £35 price tag seems low and suggests a very cheap components..


the inner filter is an off the shelf no name hozelock 2 way diverter with shut off valves still in place (£3?)
http://www.wilko.com/invt/0298817
and a length of automotive overbraid which you can buy on ebay by the meter, (email for a proportion of a meter price)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from= ... d&_sacat=0
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Straight-Wate ... SwA3dYNDxY.

as for the 'sparge arm' thats not got a lot of valve imho ;) You dont need any sort of sparge arm if you batch sparge, and if you fly sparge then a layer of punctured tin foil laid atop the grain to lay the feed hose on is all the anti channelling protection you need. That fixed feature will disturb the grain bed with a constant stream of sparge liquor hitting the same grain area continually, so not a valued feature imho.

a few online brewshops used to sell the igloo 45l cold box modded tuns but they did ask more like £80+
but you get what you pay for.. larger volume (30l+) performance cold boxes with full void insulation do cost more.

we will talk you into a diy build eventually hehe...
ist update for months n months..
Fermnting: not a lot..
Conditioning: nowt
Maturing: Challenger smash, and a kit lager
Drinking: dry one minikeg left in the store
Coming Soon Lots planned for the near future nowt for the immediate :(

spanspoon

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by spanspoon » Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:47 pm

id pay a bit more and order one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ACE-Micro-Bre ... Swal5YHGtg

consider the 'no chill' method so then you wouldn't require a wort chiller.

grab the other bits and pieces from wilkos which should come in for less than £30.

this set up will give you much more control of your brewing and you can do a stepped mash.

Donald
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Donald » Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:50 pm

The same 'Ace microbrewery' etc are 250USD on alibaba - direct from China.

Obviously, risk vs reward over a UK seller but the discount is whopping..

gobuchul

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by gobuchul » Fri Feb 10, 2017 3:48 pm

Do you have a link please?

I can't find it on Alibaba or Aliexpress.

irv
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Posts: 92
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by irv » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:44 pm

gobuchul wrote:Do you have a link please?

I can't find it on Alibaba or Aliexpress.
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 32460.html

keep in mind you would have to pay delivery, import duties and charges and then not have any waranty

Zammo

Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Zammo » Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:44 am

I've priced up a kit with an Igloo mash tun and a better Ace boiler, both from ebay and the rest of the bits from wilko and its come in just £28.53 more expensive than the original kit I was thinking of getting. The Igloo mash tun does look to be a bit more solid, I'll run it by my friend but I'm sure he'll think its the right choice. Sadly I think that other Ace boiler is a little out of our price range and I don't like the look of trying to get it from the Alibaba website.

Ace Boiler:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ACE-BEER-MASH ... SwZJBYAOdG

Igloo Mash Tun:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mash-Tun-42-l ... SwNnRYkgqm


Thanks for all the help!

Fil
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Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: All Grain Starter Kit

Post by Fil » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:43 am

looks more like it ;) most folk who use the ace boilers seem to like em, and the round igloo tun will be a doddle to fit a false bottom into ;)

happy brewing
ist update for months n months..
Fermnting: not a lot..
Conditioning: nowt
Maturing: Challenger smash, and a kit lager
Drinking: dry one minikeg left in the store
Coming Soon Lots planned for the near future nowt for the immediate :(

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