Can anything survive the boil?

[Naich]

I'm having trouble with a really persistent infection that gives the beer a musty/TCP type taint after about a month in the keg. I've been paying special attention to sanitising all the equipment that the beer comes into contact with after the boil, but I'm now wondering about the rest of the kit. If there was something nasty lurking in the mash tun, for example, is it feasible that it might survive a 90 minute boil?

[Pinto]

Not unless you have CJD prions in there.

What are you brewing/fermenting in ? Is there an old plastics bucket or fermenter that could be causing a taint ? PVC garden hose is notorious for leaching if its involved in your cooling process somehow

[Underground Joe]

Do you take the taps of your keg apart to give them a good clean? The first time I did I was shocked how much crap was in there.

[Naich]

It's got to be something post-boil then. I'm fermenting in one of these and using a King Keg TT for a keg. I always strip down the individual parts (including the barrel tap) to clean it. I've been cleaning with washing up detergent and sanitising with a chlorine-based steraliser. I'm wondering if it's worth switching to an oxi-clean type cleaner and doing a final no-rinse sanitise with peracetic acid after the chlorine. Maybe boil up the transfer tube as well?

[Underground Joe]

How many rinses do you give your keg after the chlorine sterliser?

[Mr. Dripping]

There are some micro organisms that can survive the boil - the endospores of certain bacteria are very resilient. They do not need nutrition and can survive in pretty extreme conditions.
When conditions for bacterial survival become marginal, they produce the endospore that is released as the bacteria dies and their cells degrade. These then lie dormant and are reactivated when conditions for bacterial growth become favourable again.
I'm not saying that you have some underlying issue, but I thought it was important to correct Pintos post.
For interest; the CJD prion needs some rather extreme conditions to bring about deactivation. It will survive a standard autoclave cycle of 121 degrees C for 15 mins.
The rendering regulations (I work in the industry) were changed following the BSE crisis and it is EU law that animal material that could contain these prions must be processed at 133 degrees C at a minimum pressure of 3 bar (absolute) for a minimum time of 20 mins. It is deemed high risk and must be processed through a dedicated system.

[Naich]

How many rinses do you give your keg after the chlorine sterliser?

Two cold, one hot and another cold one. I'm pretty sure it's not that.

[Underground Joe]

That's one more rinse than I do. Looks like Starsan could be the way forward as a final measure, that's what I do.

[jmc]

How many rinses do you give your keg after the chlorine sterliser?

Two cold, one hot and another cold one. I'm pretty sure it's not that.

Whenever I clean with bleach or anything chlorine based I rinse then follow with rinse of Sod Metabisulphate as this will remove any trace chlorine. Its belt & braces but I'm happier doing that.

Have you tried using oxy to clean and starsan to sanitise. Highly recommended.

Other source of chlorine could be your water supply. Do you treat it at all with a campden tablet (1 per 50L)?

[barney]

Are you Leaving the fermentation "untouched" or are you peeking inside the top to check the krausen, Drawing samples through the tap to check for gravity Etc. Low level contamination is easy peasy especially during summer.

I use a similar fermentor, amongst others, and my DEEP clean is AS follows, Oxyclean soak and soft cloth scrub of visible detritus 20mins 3 rinse, Murphy cleaner steriliser soak 20 mins 3 rinse, antiformin s soak 20 mins and 3 rinse and then either starsan swirl and use or a couple of ltr Sod Met soloution if I am going to store for a few weeks/months.

Its worked everytime I have had an issue, even with old crusty stuff bought S/hand at car boots etc

[Belter]

Just on the off chance. I don't suppose you are using SO4 yeast?

[orlando]

I am nowhere near as fastidious a some of you guys but I do avoid "extreme" cleaning agents, I have arrived at the conclusion that a good clean to remove any visible dirt then using PBW and Starsan in the exact quantities is all you need. I use JMC's excel calculators to ensure the exact quantities.

[Naich]

Interesting to hear other people's routines. In answer to some questions - one musty batch was using US-05 and the other was using "West Coast Style" yeast - nice yeast BTW. I try not to expose the beer to the outside world, but it's possible the infections get in when I transfer from boiler to FV and then from FV to keg. I Campden all the liquor but I've not been swilling with it after using the chlorine cleaner. I've done another brew now, and this time I've given everything a good scrub with Oxi, steralised with chlorine cleaner and done a final rinse with an peracetic acid steraliser.

The IC was pretty grungy before I cleaned it up a bit. Maybe something survived the 15 minute boil?