Nth East Scottish water

[drumgerry]

Hi all

Just gearing up for my first AG brew. Getting the gear together and sussing out what I need to do with my water if anything.

Got a report back from Scottish Water and I'm not sure if it helps me or not. I've looked at the water treatment calculator but again my poor wee brain isn't up to all that chemistry mullarkey. I have tried to use it but I don't know enough to know if I'm doing it right.

Here's the info I got back. If anyone could help me or tell me what I need to do to sort my water for brewing ,say, a stout I'd be forever in their debt.

Hardness expressed as Calcium 21.6 mg/l
Hardness expressed as Calcium Carbonate 54.1 mg/l
No information supplied as to Magnesium content
Sodium - mean of 8.825 mg/l
Sulphate - mean of 23.225 mg/l
Chloride - mean of 13.65 mg/l

There's plenty of other values given in the report but these are the ones which are asked for in the calculator. What would be brilliant would be if someone who knows how to use the calculator put my values into it, took a screenshot and posted it here! Or am I asking for too much?!

Like I said I'd quite like to brew a stout cos I'm quite fond of the stuff but I'd be interested to hear if there's anything my water would be particularly suited for in its current state.

Cheers

Gerry

[Graham]

The most important variable is total alkalinity, which is missing.

It hasn't really got any to speak of. Drungerry won't need to worry about carbonate reduction CRS and the like; carbonate is within acceptable limits, for pale ale at least and probably anything else too - a bit on the low side if anything. Just needs to get his calcium up, and you can be very approximate about that, mash pH withstanding - but that is chicken and egg anyway. He could probably bottle that stuff and sell it to home brewers if he could match ASDA prices.

[Graham]

The carbonate is lower than I thought when sulphate is taken into account, but still okay.
Here is a step-by-step guide to using the calculator - do stuff in this order.

Top Row
Alkilinity: 0
Carbonate reduction method: None
Hardness: 0

Your Water Composition
Ca: 21.6
Mg: 0
Na: 8.8
CO3: 17.7
SO4: 23.2
Cl: 13.65

Then set Target water to "General Purpose" (This is your first AG - no need to be finicky about it - It'll still be fine for stout)

Then hit the "Balance CO3" Button next to "note 10"

And that is it. Put your volume to be treated into the appropriate box and it is all done.

I should write a better "water guesser" for the calculator that takes sulphate into account when estimating alkalinity from hardness. Someone will have to nudge me (several times) if they want me to do that. I had more or less forgotten about the water calculator.

[drumgerry]

Thanks for the help guys . Graham - just put the values as advised into the water calculator and it seems I don't have to do a a helluva lot to the water. So I'm well happy! I take it adding the little bits of Gypsum and Epsom salts etc will bring my mash ph into the right ballpark as well as giving me enough calcium for the whole process? Now I need to figure out when in the process to add it all - or do I add some things to the mash and others to the boil?

Interestingly before I had your advice Graham and was messing around with the calculator I put my 54.1 into the hardness box in the top row and it guesstimated my calcium figure as 21.66.

And btw Graham - you have another very satisfied customer with your book. I find myself referring to it all the time as I build up to the big day.

Cheers and thanks again

Gerry

[RabMaxwell]

I reinstalled my Pc a few months ago & never bothered putting Promash back in. But we don't really need Promash when we have Mr Wheelers Beer Engine & his water calculator. How is integrating the water calculator into the Beer Engine going Graham is it still on the cards Look's like drumgerry has high C03 compared to mine in Ayrshire at 4.33 C03

[Graham]

Basically all you really need for your water is to get your calcium levels up above the minimum required to keep various processes happy. It depends upon what water treatment salts you have as to how you do that. The Epsom salts do not affect mash pH, they just add magnesium ions for the yeast - you could probably get away without it, but what the heck.

You'll need to treat more water than your brew length, because you'll lose some during the process, but I would treat the lot - it saves messing around with working out ratios and the like, and it is less likely to be forgotten. Gypsum can be difficult to get into solution cold, but you can premix it in a bit of water first using a whisk or blender.

I can't predict what the mash pH will be - that is beyond my capability, but it will be close enough- particularly for a first attempt. If your mash pH is persistently lower than you'd like it to be, then it might be necessary to split the treatment between mash and boil, but that is something for the future. Not worth worrying about first time round.

Thanks for you comments about the book. Pity they wouldn't let me do the big book.

[Graham]

How is integrating the water calculator into the Beer Engine going Graham is it still on the cards

I suppose that is a nudge. I suppose I'd better do something about that.

[drumgerry]

Graham just out of interest is there much to be gained from using the stout settings on the calculator for my brew? Like you said it may just be finickiness for a first AG but I'd be interested to hear what effects I might get from the stout settings.

Cheers

Gerry

[Graham]

Graham just out of interest is there much to be gained from using the stout settings on the calculator for my brew? Like you said it may just be finickiness for a first AG but I'd be interested to hear what effects I might get from the stout settings.

There is no harm in doing so as long as the calculator does not throw up anything impractical, like calcium carbonate (washing soda) or chalk. Basically stouts, by repute, have higher levels of chloride than would a pale ale. But there is a lot of myth surrounding appropriate water treatments for certain styles of beer. Much of which is bunkum. Wheeler has no experience of low alkalinity water, and in the past Wheeler has led many people astray because of that hole in his practical experience. You need to talk to people on here that are in soft water areas; regretfully Wheeler isn't one of them.

You are like me - too much of a perfectionist - quite frankly - JUST BLOODY DO IT - and leave the autopsy till later. I can almost guarantee that you are about to make the best beer you have ever made - irrespective of the type of water treatment.

[drumgerry]

You're right of course Graham. Trying to dot the "i"s and cross the "t"s and I'm sure just getting on with it will serve just as well. But I have to do something while I'm waiting for the boiler and mash tun to arrive - did some major clearing out on ebay and have gone down the shiny route (well partially anyway). I'll post my first attempt on the brew days forum. Can't wait!! Btw - it's going to be the Four Shades of Stout recipe I think although I'm swithering whether to do an oatmeal stout instead.

Cheers

Gerry