Tested CaCo3 value no where near published figures

[Steveicky]

I have finally got around to buying myself a Salifert Alkalinity testing kit to try and get some accurate readings for my water treatment.

The result of the test is a massive variance to the published figures as below:

Anglian water stated CaCo3 of 333.75 ppm
Salifert Test converted to CaCo3 of 211 ppm

The reading that I got from the Salifert test was 0.24 which shows an alkalinity value of 4.22 meq/l on the table provided. I have multiplied the 4.22 X 50 to get the CaCo3 figure. Assuming that I did the test correctly, is my conversion from meq/l to CaCo3 correct? If it is, then I have been over treating my water with CRS quite considerably.

Also, is it normal to find sucha large variances to published figures?

[Eric]

Yes, I think your calculation is correct.
As you have probably found, it is a minefield and often leads to confusion.
What you just measured was your water's alkalinity. Was the Anglian Water's figure that, or was it some hardness figure? Both are expressed in mg/l or ppm of CaCO3. Making things worse, CaCO3 is virtually insoluble meaning there is none in water. Measurements are expressed as the amount of CaCO3 that would have the same influence as whatever minerals there have.
Malts contain acids that react with alkaline minerals in the mash liquor and it helps vastly if you can match those two. This can be confirmed by measuring pH at the start or very soon into the mash.
Are such variances from water company figures normal? NO. Can you work reliably with water company figures? NO.

[Steveicky]

This is what Anglian publish, all relating to hardness:

Drinking water hardness

The water in your area is very hard.

To help set your domestic appliances, the water hardness in different units is:
333.75 mg/l (or parts per million) :Calcium Carbonate
133.5 mg/l (or parts per million) :Calcium
23.229 °C egrees Clark
33.375 °F egrees French
18.957 °dH egrees German
3.338 mmol/l :Millimoles

I guess that I should just ignore this and use the Salifert result to calculate the amount of CRS to use.

[Eric]

The given figures are not for alkalinity and therefore, as you say, should be ignored while the figure you obtained is what you need.
CRS will convert those carbonates to sulphates and chlorides at a ratio of about 4:3 at a rate of about 180 mg/ml of CRS.
So might I suggest you try 1ml of CRS into a litre of your tap water in a glass jug (or with lesser amounts pro rata), give it a good stir with a wooden or plastic spoon and do the test again when it completely stops gassing. You should then get a value around 31 ppm CaCO3 or (0.62 mEq/l), just a tad high of norm for a pale ale and a bit low for the likes of a brown ale, to which you then might easily make any final and accurate adjustment.
Good luck.

[Steveicky]

Thanks Eric that all makes sense.

Do I need to add gypsum to increase the calcium levels or am I ok to leave this alone? GW calculator does not seem to estimate Calcium for you but info I have found from other sources suggest CaCo3 x 0.4 is the formula. If this is correct then my calcium levels are a bit low.

London pride is an example of the type of beers that I am normally brewing.

[orlando]

I recently had my water analysed by Murphy & Son and there were some significant differences from the averaged figures of Anglian Water. Arguably a little expensive but I considered important enough to take the plunge, even though it is only a snapshot and the water will vary over the year. If you decide to take the plunge I would ignore the requirement of 500 ml of your water because I happened to be there when the sample was analysed and the amount used would of filled a thimble, so to save postage I wouldn't send much more than 100 ml.

[Eric]

Thanks Eric that all makes sense.

Do I need to add gypsum to increase the calcium levels or am I ok to leave this alone? GW calculator does not seem to estimate Calcium for you but info I have found from other sources suggest CaCo3 x 0.4 is the formula. If this is correct then my calcium levels are a bit low.

London pride is an example of the type of beers that I am normally brewing.

Fine Steve, last things first? For many irrelevant reasons I use my own recipes, so don't know what might be in your London Pride, but suggest you could start with a residual level of alkalinity of around 40 ppm CaCO3. That would require sufficient CRS to convert the equivalent of 170mg of calcium carbonate into brewing salts. Now those (bi)carbonates are not all of calcium, so neither will those salts all be of calcium. However, they mostly will, so while your 40% is right in a pure theoretical scientific way, there will be somewhat less, let us say about 60ppm. Also there will already be some dissolved calcium salts in your water, so there will be enough calcium in your liquor to make good beer.
While you can, and in time will, influence the flavour profile of your beer with extra salts, I would suggest you add no more to your next mash, that you might find what your altered, but unenhanced, water makes (you might wish to add a bit calcium and lesser magnesium to your boil for the yeast). Later you might investigate adding salts to give a 2:1 and/or a 1:2 ratio of sulphate and chloride.

The atomic weight of calcium is 40, carbon 12 and oxygen 16 such that the weight of a molecule of CaCO3 is 40 + 12 + (16 x 3) = 100, hence the amount of calcium in CaCO3 is 40% or 0.4 which means calculating might be easier than using software you doubt and producing more decimal points than you can possibly use. Similar, but less convivial, gypsum is 136 with calcium 29.5% and sulphate 70.5%; calcium chloride (CaCl2, remember valency?) is 111, 36% and 64% respectively. Leave sodium and magnesium at first, you can make more than adequate beer with what comes in your water and malts, but do remember that some salts come containing water (molecular weight 18) such that you would then need to add extra to compensate for water content.

Good luck.

[Steveicky]

To date, I have only added Campden & CRS to my water and have completely over estimated the level of CRS required (used 1.5ml per L). This still gave me a dramatic improvement in the quality of the beer that I am producing, so getting the CRS level correct is probably all I need to do for now.

For my next brew I will try 1ml CRS per litre and leave the Calcium alone as it is making my small brain hurt.

Thanks

[Eric]

To date, I have only added Campden & CRS to my water and have completely over estimated the level of CRS required (used 1.5ml per L). This still gave me a dramatic improvement in the quality of the beer that I am producing, so getting the CRS level correct is probably all I need to do for now.

For my next brew I will try 1ml CRS per litre and leave the Calcium alone as it is making my small brain hurt.

Thanks

Yes, getting rid of excess bicarbonates is possibly the biggest single improvement you can make in a hard water area, I found any other water treatment futile until I managed to control that.
Do one more thing Steve, test it after the CRS to confirm it is somewhere near what you want and keep a record.