As title, has anyone tried the batch sparging technique ?
Seems nice and simple and after the hassles I've had with "traditional" sparging in my last two brews then I'm tempted to give it a go....
Batch sparging
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bitter_dave
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I did what wheeler calls remashing, which I THINK is the same as batch sparging - draining the wort, adding hot water at 80 C, stiring, leaving for 15 mins, then draining again.
I did it because I messed up the grain surface. It was very easy, and I didn't need to return much to the surface to get it to run reasonably clear.
Obviously can't comment on how it compares to normal sparging as it was my first attempt at AG. My final volume was considerably lower than it should have been, but I think this was because I stopped sparging much too early. Next time I'll be more careful and add more spargings during the boil if I go too much over my brew length.
I got the impression you were quite happy with your last attempt, the results sound good
I did it because I messed up the grain surface. It was very easy, and I didn't need to return much to the surface to get it to run reasonably clear.
Obviously can't comment on how it compares to normal sparging as it was my first attempt at AG. My final volume was considerably lower than it should have been, but I think this was because I stopped sparging much too early. Next time I'll be more careful and add more spargings during the boil if I go too much over my brew length.
I got the impression you were quite happy with your last attempt, the results sound good
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Andy
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The last two sparges haven't been good. Really slow runoff, much slower than the rate the spinny sparger is adding water so a head of water builds up above the grain bed. So have to turn off spinny sparger, wait for water level to go down close to the grain bed level before restarting the sparge. This results in the temperature of water in the tube from the HLT -> spinny sparger decreasing (and the goods + water in the tun) and so when I start sparging again I can get nowhere near 78degC sparge output even with virtually boiling water in the HLT. I've had a stuck mash also with the last two, not good.
Hence batch sparging is looking attractive.
Hence batch sparging is looking attractive.
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BlightyBrewer
I can vouch for the copper manifold. No stuck run-off, flowed quite nicely.
I think I am going to try batch sparging next. I got the feeling I sparged way to quickly with my last brew, and the resultant wort was rather "watery" (very light in colour). I used a watering can rose, similar to bitter dave's I think. It was all too much hassle for me, so batch sparging appeals. I have heard good reports from other quarters concerning this technique.
I think I am going to try batch sparging next. I got the feeling I sparged way to quickly with my last brew, and the resultant wort was rather "watery" (very light in colour). I used a watering can rose, similar to bitter dave's I think. It was all too much hassle for me, so batch sparging appeals. I have heard good reports from other quarters concerning this technique.
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FlippinMental
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i'm nothing but an armchair brewer at this time so i can only repeat what i have read elsewhere, and not very accurately to boot - but here goes.
andy, do you run off the wort collected on completion of mash and then start sparging? if you do then there may lay your slow sparge run off. theory has it that this practice allows the grain bed to collapse, hindering the permeation of sparge water.
not balancing flow rate into/out of mash tun can cause all kinds of problems, from the collapse of the bed to creating streams of sparge water within the mash leading to poor extraction. then there's the tannin danger to remember.
It would appear best practice when fly sparging is to never let the water level fall below the level of the grain, match flow rates, don't flow too fast, and once run off has started don't stop it. other than that it's a doddle. Still wondering why I'm so keen on batch sparging?
If you do abandon fly sparging what you going to do with the twirly-gig? Something innovative I'd wager.
andy, do you run off the wort collected on completion of mash and then start sparging? if you do then there may lay your slow sparge run off. theory has it that this practice allows the grain bed to collapse, hindering the permeation of sparge water.
not balancing flow rate into/out of mash tun can cause all kinds of problems, from the collapse of the bed to creating streams of sparge water within the mash leading to poor extraction. then there's the tannin danger to remember.
It would appear best practice when fly sparging is to never let the water level fall below the level of the grain, match flow rates, don't flow too fast, and once run off has started don't stop it. other than that it's a doddle. Still wondering why I'm so keen on batch sparging?
If you do abandon fly sparging what you going to do with the twirly-gig? Something innovative I'd wager.
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Andy
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I'll agree that on paper it all sounds a piece of p*ss.
But practice has shown otherwise!
I do stop/start the output flow from the tun though, perhaps next time I'll just leave this running and juggle collection buckets as they fill up (I can't collect directly into the boiler so collect in stages and transfer each bucket to the boiler as I go). I've tried leaving a couple of cm of wort above the grain bed but this also gave a stuck mash.
But practice has shown otherwise!
I do stop/start the output flow from the tun though, perhaps next time I'll just leave this running and juggle collection buckets as they fill up (I can't collect directly into the boiler so collect in stages and transfer each bucket to the boiler as I go). I've tried leaving a couple of cm of wort above the grain bed but this also gave a stuck mash.-
tribs
Hi,
I've done 2 AG batches thus far. Both have been batch sparges. There really is nothing to it. Denny Conn and US homebrewer from Oregon has pretty much nailed down the technique http://hbd.org/cascade/dennybrew/.
tribs
I've done 2 AG batches thus far. Both have been batch sparges. There really is nothing to it. Denny Conn and US homebrewer from Oregon has pretty much nailed down the technique http://hbd.org/cascade/dennybrew/.
tribs
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bod
it was denny who taught me how to batch sparge, he's a very useful man!!! i think andy was asking me in another thread how to batch sparge, and i never got round to replying, but thats exactly what i do.
to get a 5 gallon batch, i heat 4 gallons to sparge temp, about 73c, then add the grains, that takes it down to 66c. leave for an hour-ish, run off enough wort so that the grain bed is not exposed, then add another 3 gallons at 77c so i get a grain bed temp of arround 70c which is ideal for mash out temps, stir, rest for 15 mins, run off again, and collect 6 gallons. i loose 1 gallon in the mash tun, from grain absorbtion, and dead space.
when boiling i loose about half a gallon in evaporation(maybe more), and up to half a gallon is lef in the boiler along with the trub and hops.
simple really!
to get a 5 gallon batch, i heat 4 gallons to sparge temp, about 73c, then add the grains, that takes it down to 66c. leave for an hour-ish, run off enough wort so that the grain bed is not exposed, then add another 3 gallons at 77c so i get a grain bed temp of arround 70c which is ideal for mash out temps, stir, rest for 15 mins, run off again, and collect 6 gallons. i loose 1 gallon in the mash tun, from grain absorbtion, and dead space.
when boiling i loose about half a gallon in evaporation(maybe more), and up to half a gallon is lef in the boiler along with the trub and hops.
simple really!
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bod
i keep it simple, and just mash for an hour. i've never had any issues of not hitting my target OG. think my system runs at 75% efficiency, whch is just a bucket with a stainless steel braided hose attached, covered in cushions/towels for the initial mash period, and then just left open on the counter top for the additional 15 mins.
the four gallons to start with seems high, but as i said, i loose a gallon in the mash tun from the grain and dead space. the mash is normally pretty loose/thin though. might try it the other way round this weekend just to see what happens.
the four gallons to start with seems high, but as i said, i loose a gallon in the mash tun from the grain and dead space. the mash is normally pretty loose/thin though. might try it the other way round this weekend just to see what happens.
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James
QUOTE (bod @ Mar 29 2006, 07:41 AM)i keep it simple, and just mash for an hour.... ...just a bucket with a stainless steel braided hose attached, covered in cushions/towels for the initial mash period
Those are wise words bod, keeping it simple is important in AG; your setup is the same as mine.
I reckon SS braid is much less aggro than a slotted copper manifold and makes for a very easy to construct, clean and use system, so I don’t think this is Andys problem.
It could be too little mash water, so the mash sits there for an hour-hour and a half and just clogs the braid, even if you add more water it doesn’t matter, the braids already clogged and isn’t going to clear. Try using more mash water; make make the grain 'float', and always add grain to water (not vice versa)
I messed up the other day and got distracted, leaving nearly all the mash water to drain away, for a few minutes compacting the grain bed. I turned off the tap, added more water, the grain bed rose and off I went again, no clogging....
JC
Those are wise words bod, keeping it simple is important in AG; your setup is the same as mine.
I reckon SS braid is much less aggro than a slotted copper manifold and makes for a very easy to construct, clean and use system, so I don’t think this is Andys problem.
It could be too little mash water, so the mash sits there for an hour-hour and a half and just clogs the braid, even if you add more water it doesn’t matter, the braids already clogged and isn’t going to clear. Try using more mash water; make make the grain 'float', and always add grain to water (not vice versa)
I messed up the other day and got distracted, leaving nearly all the mash water to drain away, for a few minutes compacting the grain bed. I turned off the tap, added more water, the grain bed rose and off I went again, no clogging....
JC
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bod
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tribs
Personally, I think your problems are down to your mashout temperature being too low. Hence the stuck sparges. Have a go at batch sparging (Ditch the spinny thing) I think it'll solve your issues.
Also when you have a stuck sparge just blow back up the outlet and that should unclog the system after adding more hot water to raise the temp.
tribs
Also when you have a stuck sparge just blow back up the outlet and that should unclog the system after adding more hot water to raise the temp.
tribs
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Andy
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I must admit - the two times I've had a problem has been when I've used the last hundred grams or so of malt I didn't use in a previous brewing session. This tends to accumulate all the fine flour and small crush stuff (finds its way to the bottom of the bag) so perhaps that's the prob ? I got my grain from the Hogs Back brewery and it's pre-crushed. They get it supplied pre-crushed from their supplier, I guess it's possible that they specify a fine crush as their commercial mash tun can cope with that and finer crush will yield higher efficiency I believe...
I am familiar with the blowback technique and have employed it in the last two sparges B)
I am familiar with the blowback technique and have employed it in the last two sparges B)