Allowing for Hop Age in Recipes

[SiHoltye]

The AA% of stored hops decreases over time. Do people take account of this?

If you were to go out tomorrow and buy Styrians (if you can find'em ) at 4% from the 2007 harvest they'll give you only 3.5% today, if they've been room temperature stored. If they're 2006 harvest then they'll have only 2.7% AA.

(This suggestion is based on vacuum plastic packing and 25% AA losses over 6 months.)

Are we many of us under bittering our beers? That's my thought/concern. I sure have been

[steve_flack]

I keep my hops in the freezer so the alpha loss is very low.

It also depends however how the shop stores them. I know that Ross at craftbrewer refrigerates his hops from when he gets them until they are shipped.

In any event, my understanding is that alpha isn't the only thing that determines bitterness. There was an interesting Basic Brewing Radio podcast recently with John Palmer and he reported on a scientific brewing meeting he went to where lots of hop related stuff was discussed that differs quite a bit from the received homebrewing wisdom.

I believe it's also in the new BYO (but I haven't got around to reading it yet)

[SiHoltye]

Given quite a few people use H&G on here, it might be interesting to know how they store theirs, and whether prior to getting them how they are treated. My LHBS helpfully hang their selection of Brupaks silver vacu packed hops on display probably in direct sunlight some of the day .

I've got a book that talks about other bits of a hop contributing bitterness to, though it then says that AA's contribute by far the most, and the most noticeable by the palate. This is not my opinion through research though, I'm just quoting.

[bandit]

H&G store their gold foil packets at the back of the shop out of and contact with the sun. Other hops are in cold storage with the yeasts. John and Patsy are very proud of their successful business and take great care with their produce. Ageing is the main issue and I think a 2006 crop sold today will be, as we have already discussed, nowhere near its advertised AA%. It may be useful to other members to tabulate an AA% drop chart for a given AA over time showing that a fresh AA on day one, say at 4% will only be 2.1% after 18 months etc

[maltman]

Hop Storage: How to Get - and Keep - Your Hops' Optimum Value

BrewingTechniques

Link contains information on predicting AA drop of some common hops.

I know Beer Smith has a hop age predictor built into it already.

[steve_flack]

People might find this useful as well.

http://www.hopunion.com/hopunion-variety-databook.pdf

[Ross]

I have found little difference in bittering potential of old hops against newer one. It is my understanding that as the Alpha acids decrease, the Beta acids increase & in effect cancel each other out. I doubt this is the whole story, but I've never had to increase hops additions when using older hops.

cheers Ross

[iowalad]

Ray Daniels has a discussion on old hops in his designing great beers book. I have to admit I did not follow it too closely but he did not seem overly concerned about using older hops for bittering. I believe there was also a discussion that older hops used for aroma provided more pleasing aromas to some.

I don't have the book handy at the moment.

[Martin the fish]

Those here who brew Durden Park recipe's don't have the choice of an AA content. So does that make their beers worse? Not from the reports i've heard from DP recipes and those who brew them.

Are we getting hung up on technicalities when the proof, as they say, is in the pudding?

For my taste i find that i don't enjoy an ale that is bitter. I do enjoy a nice hop aroma and flavour so i try to add the majority of my hops after the boil.

Ross's hops have more aroma than any i have previously purchased-even the 06 stock of his is great.
But again i must emphasise-don't buy any cos i want them all.

[SiHoltye]

I posted this on the back of beers that were proving the pudding to be incorrect (ie. unexpectedly not bitter enough)

Those here who brew anything have total choice as to the level of IBU's they try to put in their beer. This is all worked back to the AA's put on the back, but by appreciating the storage and age you can get closer to approximating your hops potential at time of brewing. I hear you about the historical limitations there were on scientific analysis concerning the fine Durden Park re-worked historical brews. They hopped from experience and judged beers as they went along. I brewed 2 at the turn of the year, one is mature and now cracking, the second I'm gonna enjoy in a months time. Got to totally recommend the 1880 Simmonds Bitter and 1850 London Porter. Can you get the book Martin? If not some are on DP website. This isn't a gripey comeback post at all. Buy a spare corni, fill it with DP and forget it 'til Xmas, they're top draw.

I think the point I wanted to highlight in this thread is, if you are brewing beers that you want to have a specific hop bitterness profile then be aware that the ability for any hop to impart bitterness degrades over time. This is something I did not account for. It matters when brewing a 1.045 bitter and expecting 32 IBU's and you only get 19. Now I have a keg of well aroma hopped 'very mild'.

Just trying to help prevent others experiencing an easily remediable fault.

Now this is considered and I've dumped God knows what in the last brew to use up unspecific hops, can't wait for the next brewday! I consider myself reinvigorated (if that was necessary).