Whitewater recipes?

[Jymbo]

Anyone here ever tasted Belfast Ale or Clotworthy Dobbin from the Whitewater Brewing Co. in N.Ireland?

I was just wondering if someone had a recipe for a clone or at least something similar?

[delboy]

Anyone here ever tasted Belfast Ale or Clotworthy Dobbin from the Whitewater Brewing Co. in N.Ireland?

I was just wondering if someone had a recipe for a clone or at least something similar?

Hi Jymbo
Are you from this part of the world if you are you could check out the hilden beer festival on from this friday until monday. Whitewater will have their belfast ale and solstice at it. I suppose the brewers at hilden could help you figure out what hops and malts they are using.
Im going tomorrow so i'll put my beer tasting/cloning head on and see if i can figure out what would be an approximation of belfast ale (haven't tried it for a while).

I see their clotworthy dobbin got a good write up, supposedly in the top 50 in the world.
Article below

Real ale in world's best 50 beers

Brewer Bernard Sloan and Mark Bleakney of Invest NI with the ale
A real ale produced by a small Northern Ireland brewery has been judged one of the best 50 beers in the world.
Whitewater Brewing Company at Kilkeel won the accolade in the prestigious International Beer Challenge 2007.

The brewery's main product, Clotworthy Dobbin Ale, captured the attention of the judges who included beer critics, brewers, buyers and retailers.

Its taste and packaging put it ahead of a host of international entries. The company employs just three people.

It will now be in the running for the International Beer Challenge's Supreme Champion award which will be announced in London in October.

The Whitewater Brewing Company was set up by brewer Bernard Sloan and his wife, Kerry, in 1997.

We set out to produce an ale that was different, that offered a fresh, crisp taste

Bernard Sloan
Brewer

Mr Sloan said: "Gaining a listing as one of the world's top 50 beers is a marvellous endorsement of the quality of our Clotworthy Dobbin Ale.

"We set out to produce an ale that was different, that offered a fresh, crisp taste and we've succeeded by using only the best quality ingredients and traditional brewing techniques."

Whitewater already numbers major retailers among its customers as well as many leading bars.

Recently it gained a gold award in the UK Guild of Fine Food's Great Taste Awards for its Belfast Ale.

Sales have grown by 30% over the past year and the company has made a substantial investment in the latest bottling technology - with the support of business development agency Invest Northern Ireland.

The brewery now has the capacity to bottle up to 1,000 bottles an hour.

Mr Sloan said: "The growth in demand for our products has led to the plant operating at full capacity and we are looking at on-site expansion options.

Maynard Mawhinney, Invest NI's director of food, said it was a "tremendous accolade" for the brewery.

"(It) shows that by focusing on quality and taste even the smallest Northern Ireland company can compete successfully with much bigger and longer established enterprises in the UK and from further afield," he said.

[galaxian]

They also brew (or did) Knight Porter, if you get a chance try it, my favourite beer by a long shot.

[Jymbo]

Are you from this part of the world if you are you could check out the hilden beer festival on from this friday until monday.

Yes, I'm from Crosshill, Co. Antrim. Unfortunately couldn't make it to Hilden this year due to a wedding on Saturday that took up all day Sunday as well, if you know what I mean

Glad to see that Clotworthy is getting some recognition - it's a delicious ale.

Would be interested to hear your opinions on what's in the Belfast Ale - I'm still fairly new to AG so not really in a position to formulate recipes just yet.

Jymbo

[Jymbo]

I rang the Whitewater brewery this morning to see if I could get any info on the recipe for Clotworthy - also to see if they would sell me malt or hops, but they didn't seem interested in selling in small (homebrew) quantities and they were very tightlipped about their ingredients

The only info I got out of them was that they use mainly English hops and their base malts come from Kildare. That really narrows things down!

Back to the drawing board.......

[oblivious]

The Beer & Cider in Ireland: The Complete Guide has a bit about the grist i think, i will try and post something tomorrow

[Jymbo]

Cheers, oblivious,

There is a citrus/grapefruit flavour to the hops so I've something to work with there. Also it's quite dry with mild esters so I figure Wyeast Irish would be a suitable yeast. Any more info would be gratefully received.

[delboy]

I've tasted this many times now it certainly is a good pint. The blurb on the bottle says it uses the orginal yeast from the clotworthy dobbin brewery, a little detective work shows that the brewery merged with bass and also that the guy brewing at whitewater is an ex employee of bass, im guessing the yeast is simply the bass yeast.
Not sure about the hops but i'd guess that dark crystal malt figures in the grist.
Good luck on brewing something similar.

[oblivious]

completely forgot to look this up, will do to night

[oblivious]

Clotworthy Dobbin grist is supposed to be made up of pale, crystal, chocolate and black malt

I would say since they are using chocolate and black malt it probably standard crystal malt and the roasted malt around 2%

Hops are Challenger and North down for bittering and some Cascade at the end of boil

Belfast Ale grist is pale, crystal, chocolate and some malted wheat for head retention.

Hops are challenger, North down and Goldings for bittering and some Fuggles at the end of boil. It is susposed to be bitter that an Irish red but less an a best bitter

Hope this is of help

[delboy]

Clotworthy Dobbin grist is supposed to be made up of pale, crystal, chocolate and black malt

I would say since they are using chocolate and black malt it probably standard crystal malt and the roasted malt around 2%

Hops are Challenger and North down for bittering and some Cascade at the end of boil

Belfast Ale grist is pale, crystal, chocolate and some malted wheat for head retention.

Hops are challenger, North down and Goldings for bittering and some Fuggles at the end of boil. It is susposed to be bitter that an Irish red but less an a best bitter

Hope this is of help

Good info ob, i think in light that they use choc and black malt im sure you are right about it being normal crystal.

[oblivious]

I am just assuming since they have some roasted malt in the grist which will provide color and a hint of flavor and i didn't think the Belfast ale has a highly colored crystal. but I could be wrong

[Jymbo]

Thanks, oblivious, this is a great help. I'll try to put together a recipe based on the info you've provided. There's definitely a pronounced flavour from the roast malts - I was thinking amber, but chocolate would certainly make sense.

[delboy]

I was going to have a bash at sarah hughes ruby mild next but all this talk has made me think i might do a clotworthy clone first, decisions, decisions

[Jymbo]

I haven't formulated a recipe from scratch before - mucked about with existing recipes but this is a different ballgame So I've had the calculator and the Ray Daniels book out and come up with this. I'd be grateful if a few of the old hands could take a look over it and point out any glaring errors - particularly yourself, Delboy as you've tasted Clotworthy.

BTW, my efficiency has been pretty poor - I'm working on it (Water service are sending me some info). But in the meantime I've based this on 65% efficiency. Also I've calculated for 19 litres - mainly cause I'm out of keg space and I'll probably have to bottle it.

Brew Length: 19L
Target OG: 1047
Target FG: 1012
Target ABV 5%

Grain Bill (% of grist):

Marris Otter (88%): 3.1Kgs
Crystal Malt (8%): 386g
Chocolate Malt (1.5%): 92g
Black Malt (0.5%): 32g
Wheat Malt (2%): 85g

Mash at 67C for 90 mins

Bittering Hops:
Challenger/Northdown (50/50) to 24 IBUs (90 min boil)

Aroma Hops:
Cascade: 25g at end of boil

Yeast:
Wyeast Irish Ale (1084)

Ferment at 18C