St Austell's Tribute

[Rubbery]

One thing to note is that their estimation of timing is different from ours. Running off for us can be done within 1/2'hr, but its alot longer for them.

Im guessing filling the vessel till full then start running off the wort for cooling and into the fv.

Yes, I think their idea of a short time is probably a bit more than you would expect. If it takes, say, half an hour to fill the vessel, each drop of beer is in contact with the wort for half an hour. I am sure they would call that a "short time". I would have pressed the brewer further, but I was shouting across a crowded room at the time.

[weiht]

Yeah, thats what I thought as I have seen another brewery fill a vessel that contains the whole hops and start running off only after it's full. Their's is a small hop vessel and it also took at least 15 mins just to fill before running off, that means that contact time with the hops shld also at least be equal to 15 mins. So maybe 1/2hr to fill that St.a tank would be considered fast for them at that scale.

We shld do a tour exclusive to Jim forum members, that's if we are not banned yet. Damn these homebrewers

[chrisr]

That's making a lot more sense to me, now, and sounds a lot more reasonable.

I'm actually doing another brew, today, so I'll go for 30 mins steep, from 90C.

It'd take an awful lot of homebrewers to make any impact on St A! No matter how good they were, it'd never be exactly the same finished beer, there's just too many variables in brewing. And as alluded to above, they have their unique malt.

[weiht]

IMO here is a difference between what St.a is doing vs the steep that we are doing. Their wort contacts the hops at 90ish degrees for a short time and is runoff and is immediately chilled to lock in the aroma. Therefore the bitterness that comes thru will be minimal for the late hops.

Whereas steeping at 90ish for 30mins will definitely extract quite a bit of bitterness as it still isomerising at that temperature, as a result there may be lesser aroma.

I will be trying to add at flame out and whirlpool for 10'mins before starting to chill on my ic. I reckon it would take another 20-30'mins to cool it, and hopefully it locks in the aroma while still steeping and cooling.

It seems that St.a only hop at 60mins for bittering and get their hop aroma from the hop vessel at flame out, as opposed to the traditional 123 stages. I was always under the impression that skipping the 15 mins addition wld result in something missing in the middle. Guess I'm wrong

[iandiggs]

Hello. I'm going to try this recipe next; can i use s-04 yeast with it? I don't want to use nottingham yeast again as i don't think it worked properly when i used it with my summer ale. I cannot get WLP002 ale yeast from my HB outlet - do you know of any equivalent for this?
Thanks in advance...

[weiht]

Wlp002 replacement is Wyeast 1968 London esb, it's fullers strain which is not a high attenuation yeast like Nottingham yeast. So u have to mash 65c to get it to work better

[jaquiss2005]

Been reading all these threads but as someone with little experience, would welcome a definitive recipe for this one - have seen them quoting 80% Maris Otter etc, but not sure how much needs to be used.

Looking to make 23 litres - can someone simplify what I need ingredient wise as it seems there have been various tweaks to the recipe over time.

many thanks

[MattK]

I brewed a Tribute clone yesterday. I'm calling it Red Top, despite it not being red, in honour of dishonest tabloids.
I wrote about it, including my recipe, on my blog: http://sparge.wordpress.com/2011/07/18/ ... st-bitter/

[Rubbery]

This is the recipe I used here. I think it is a pretty good clone, but I am more interested in making good beer than exact clones. Late hop additions are at about 90C then cooled rapidly to trap aroma.

3200g Pale Malt
800g Munich Malt
100g Torrefied Wheat (optional for head retention)
(90 mins and batch sparge)

48g Fuggle @ 90 mins
10g Willamette @ 10 mins
25g Styrian Goldings @ -5mins
15g Willamette@ -5mins
(steeped for 15 mins)

Wyeast 1469 - West Yorkshire Ale Yeast

Final Volume: 23 Litres
Original Gravity: 1.043
Final Gravity: 1.010
Alcohol Content: 4.2% ABV
Total Liquor: 33.8 Litres
Mash Liquor: 10.3 Litres
Mash Efficiency: 80%
Bitterness: 29 EBU
Colour: 11 EBC

[weiht]

Mattk has a Gd recipe, just that strictly speaking I think a lower fg wld be more accurate. However, I also aim abt 1046 instead of the 1042 as earlier speculated. Btw I'm also planning either a red alenor ginger beer as a tribute beer for my hero paul scholes lol.

Mine is abt
3.5kg MO
800g Munich
200g victory/biscuit/light amber 20L

Fuggles 60mins 25ibu
Styrian 0mins steep 25-30g
Willamette 0mins steep 25-30g
Proceed to chill fast to lock in the aroma.

The beer has little head, has a big hop willamette berrylike aroma. Nice maltiness and toasty biscuity hints, that's reason i added some vIctory in it. Cornish gold is munIch like malt that Kilned to 20l

[MattK]

I've a feeling the colour's going to be a bit pale on mine too, so that may need adjusting.

[chrisr]

IMO here is a difference between what St.a is doing vs the steep that we are doing. Their wort contacts the hops at 90ish degrees for a short time and is runoff and is immediately chilled to lock in the aroma. Therefore the bitterness that comes thru will be minimal for the late hops.

Yes, the methodology is a bit different but no, I think we've sort of concluded the wort is in contact with the (late) hops for possibly 30 mins: the period it takes to fill their 'hop-back' and then start draining it, to balance the flow in/out. Yes, it will be chilled after.

Whereas steeping at 90ish for 30mins will definitely extract quite a bit of bitterness as it still isomerising at that temperature, as a result there may be lesser aroma.

I think there'd be minimal bitterness added by this - it takes 60-90 minutes boiling to get 30% (at most) of the available bitterness from hops. I can't see as you'd get that much bitterness from 30 mins at 90c (or possibly less, as it cools). I always believed the whole point of the late hopping was the aroma and taste, not bittering. But anyhow, it's how the real thing is made, so it needs to pick up this extra late bittering - whatever it amounts to.

[weiht]

From my understanding if the hops is sitting in the kettle for 15 mins without cooling then it cld almost be equal to a 15m boil addition in terms of bitterness extraction. That is because at that temperature, the hops are still isomerising fully and it takes quite a while for the kettle to drop to 75c on it's own. However, u may still get more aromatIcs as compared to the 15m boil addition as the oils are not aggressively boiled Off.

This is down to my own experience n later confirmed by many comments by pro brewers.

[MattK]

It may be worth noting that the St. Austell yeast seems to have quite high attenuation. Mine has gone past 80% and shows no sign of stopping. I roused it once (see if you can guess when )

[chrisr]

Yes, it does seem to. Which seems very odd considering all St A beers definitely tend towards the malty IMO. The last brew I measured (I don't always bother) was around 90%. Which seems so high as to be impossible. Or I made a mistake in the measuring

A slight digression: people in the UK may be interested in two beers available at the St A online shop. The amazing (IMHO) Proper Black black IPA and a special, Smugglers Grand Cru, an 11.5% barley wine. The latter is rather pricey! No, I'm not on commission, and I don't work for them - I wish.