Popcorn Beer (Second Attempt)

[campbellditty]

Hi guys,

I tried to make a popcorn beer a few months back for a buddy of mines who runs a movie blog website, he was looking to do a competition of some sorts for the locals and a popcorn beer being the prize. I tried to brew this for him and it turned out horribly. This is my second attempt at it so I am looking for feedback on what you would do differently. I have dialed the numbers into beersmith so they are below. I will also post my ideas on how to get this sort of flavour imparted into the beer.

http://imgur.com/4IDYaX6

: Mash at 156 to get full bodied beer as I want it almost to be chewy with a sweetness like toffee popcorn

: Caramelize 10% of first runnings and add back into the boil for additional sweetness

: Having Pilsner Malt and Carapils in the grainbill, only boil for 60 minutes to create DMS that may give the sensation of popcorn

: Add lactose 10 minutes from the end of the boil to add a smoothness to the beer.

: Ferment for roughly 3 days or whenever the yeast have finished then drop the temperature to create some Diacetyl, hopefully not a crazy amount but enough to preserve it.

If you think this will just turn out to be a huge mess please let me know. Any ideas are welcome, crazy or sane, they are all valid!

Thanks in advance

[seymour]

Why no real popped corn in the grist? You could also use an English yeast renowned for diacetyl, like Ringwood, in order to simulate butter.

[alix101]

Wow ...difficult ...goes against the norm. To create diacetyl you'll have try not to aerate the beer to much but enough so the yeast doesn't give up, you'll also need to take it of the yeast as soon as possible, maybe use a finning if it's still flocculant.
I'd probably not use fuggles as an aroma addition as it has a distinguished earthy taste which kind of goes against what your trying to achieve just aim for a cream ale type ibu of 15.
But maybe add some pop corn
https://dcylab.wordpress.com/2013/08/24 ... e-tasting/
Here is a 100% pop corn brew

[Barley Water]

First of all, DMS is going to create a flavor much like cooked vegetables not popcorn. If you want a butter bomb that is really easy (and I have done it but not on purpose). What you do is brew your beer and use Fuller's yeast to ferment it. It will go pretty quick and as soon as the stuff starts slowing down rack the beer off the yeast cake right away. If you don't allow the yeast to clean up after itself you will be left with more butter flavor than you can possibly stand. To further the popcorn you might also add some flaked corn to the grist, it adds a slightly sweet note to the beer and thins it out.

I know the above procedures will work however I really recommend you reconsider as beers like that really are not fun to drink.

[seymour]

DMS = cooked vegetables, yes. But then you went on to describe diacetyl, a different thing. I was talkIng about diacetyl too (desireable in this case) not DMS (always undesireable).

[campbellditty]

Thanks for the suggestions guys,

I know it is a bit of a crazy idea but that is what he is wanting. Ill go down the Diacatyl route and hope it's not overly powerful.

Will the lactose work for mouthfeel, i've used in stouts before but never anything like this. Also has anybody tried caramalising the wort and will iy work for this kind of project.

Thanks

[seymour]

You'll have to decide for yourself about the lactose sugar addition.

I tend to dislike it, to the point where I avoid beers at fests which contain lactose. I've never tasted one that contributed anything popcorn-like, if that's what you're asking. Sorry to be such a Debbie Downer...I'd love to be proven wrong.

[campbellditty]

Not at all Seymour!I appreciate all replys the reason I was thinking lactose was due to the silky mouthfeel it may bring, I understand its a long shot so all knowledge is useful! I am making it this sunday so if you could all have a look at the recipe and give me suggestions as the grainbill may possibly be may off.

Also regarding my choice of hop, I was going for something a bit more neutral and not fruit forward as this may take away from the popcorn beer illusion. I decided not to use actual popcorn because ive read it adds nothing to the actual flavour, maybe try a kind of dryhop with it? Seems ridicious just saying it but no idea if this would impart some flavours?

[MTW]

What did you do on the first attempt? I recall mentioning WY1469 somewhere for this. Pitch low with that, ferment at normal temperatures, rack promptly and I reckon it may well work. I like your grain choices and caramelisation too. Keep the IBUs down.

[Pinto]

Just a thought - how about a small handful of Werther's originals thrown into the last few minutes of the boil to allow them to break down ?

[campbellditty]

The first attempt resulted in a insane amount of crystal 60 which turned out a disaster. I like your yeast idea though. Will the sweets in the boil not mess with the yeast as im guessing there's weird preservatives and fats etc

[MTW]

The first attempt resulted in a insane amount of crystal 60 which turned out a disaster. I like your yeast idea though. Will the sweets in the boil not mess with the yeast as im guessing there's weird preservatives and fats etc

I used WY1469 just once and it mahoosively tasted of popcorn during fermentation; my wife concurred. We're not talking slight - it was unmistakably dominant. I gave it a good diacetyl rest and most of it shifted. I'd pitched an activator pack straight into 5 gallons of 1.050 or so of a pale, no starter. By the way, I meant pitch low as in amount of yeast, rather than temperature. If you could preserve that taste in the beer (so no rest, and off the yeast quite quick I suppose) you'd be winning.

[campbellditty]

I notice that home brew store have the smack pack in stock, I will pick up a pack to try, I doubt any dry yeast will give me the flavors i'm looking for. Thanks for the suggestion, top guy!

[Barley Water]

Apparently the way I write leaves a bit to be desired. My intent was to tell the original poster that DMS was not what he wanted but diacetyl will get you the buttered popcorn flavor you are looking for. As noted the Fuller's strain will do the job although there are others (the strain used by Guinness will also give you a butter bomb if handled incorrectly). One thing though, I don't know of any reliable way to control how much you end up getting. In certain styles I just love a touch of that flavor but only a touch. The problem is however, if you brew to accentuate that, you can easily get way too much ruining your beer. Also, I would caution against under pitching because besides getting diacetyl you might also get some fusels which I can pretty much guarantee you won't like. The only strain I like to under pitch is German Heffeweizen yeast but that style is unique in that you are trying to get as much yeast character as possible although it's pretty easy to get into a heated discussion with brewers regarding that technique (right up there with the decoction/infusion mashing debate). By the way, diacetyl in a Heffeweizen absolutely sucks.