Controlling the body of the beer through the mash temp?

[yashicamat]

I have just been sampling my first AG (it's now conditioning in the barrel, been there since Wednesday) and something which strikes me is just how sweet the aftertaste is. Now I know it's fermented out correctly, it got down to 1009 from 1041 (just on pale malt and hops, nothing extra). The mash was conducted at about 68 to 69 deg C (very constant as it was done in an oven). I've done a bit of searching and come up with not a huge amount of information (or rather, too much irrelevant information) and I note from a photo of a dedicated mash thermometer that the temperature range has 60 deg C to 65 as being "dry" then to sweet from 65 to 70, or something along those lines.

I personally am a fan of hoppy, pale and quite dry beers - would lowering the mash temp to say about 64 degrees make the beer a little drier and a little less sweet? The bittering hops are sufficient in the above beer, it's the aftertaste which is too sweet, which would perhaps suggest it's the sugar content rather than lack of bittering?

The other thing I'm going to try is an american style yeast, but I'll trot over to that forum to ask that question.

Thanks.

[edit1now]

Try doing a step at 60 degrees and a step at 66 degrees, to get it dryer?

[Jim]

Since your final gravity was 1.009 I very much doubt that this is a mash problem. If it was, the final gravity would be high.

Maybe if you give us your recipe it would help diagnose the problem; it may be that your hopping rate (or utilisation, which is the percentage of bitterness you extract from the hops) is at fault here.

[yashicamat]

Thanks for the replies so far.

The recipe for 16 litres was:

6 lbs MO
0.5oz Target 11.3% AA for 50 mins
0.5oz Amarillo 9.3% for 10 mins
0.5oz Amarillo 9.3% for 4 mins
0.25oz Cascade 10 min steep at the end
Wyeast Brit Ale 2

Estimated IBU of about 35ish.

[Northern Brewer]

Mashing at 68-9C is going to produce more non-fermentable dextrins that will add body and sweetness to your beer. Dropping your mash temperature to 65C will produce approx 5% fewer dextrins and more fermentable maltose; hence you would have less residual sweetness. Lowering the mash's PH and making it thinner would have a similar effect, albeit on a far less noticeable scale (probably less than 1%).

I get the impression that you may have worried too much about maintaining mash temperature and erred on the upper side 'to be sure'. I start my coolbox mashes at 67C then totally ignore them for 90 minutes whilst I take the dog for a walk. I find that the temperature usually drops to around 64.3C over that period and the beers work out just fine.

[Gurgeh]

yeah - what NB said. I kick off at 66C. My HERMS keeps that temp for as long as i please.

[Gurgeh]

or have a crack at it with Nottingham yeast - that should knock off a point or two from your FG

[yashicamat]

Thanks for the replies.

or have a crack at it with Nottingham yeast - that should knock off a point or two from your FG

Yep, I'm just about to order some of that as it was reccomended to me in the yeast section.

[flything]

it's now conditioning in the barrel, been there since Wednesday

Bit soon (I know it's hard...) to be drinking it; I did the same with the hunky dory I just made. Thought I'd overhopped it when I tasted sample I took to test the OG so I was very disappointed when I took a taste after it had been in the King Keg for 4 days, seemed very sweet with no bitterness. Maybe the priming sugar hadn't all been eaten up by then.

Today though, 2 weeks after it was kegged, its perfect.

[yashicamat]

it's now conditioning in the barrel, been there since Wednesday

Bit soon (I know it's hard...) to be drinking it; I did the same with the hunky dory I just made. Thought I'd overhopped it when I tasted sample I took to test the OG so I was very disappointed when I took a taste after it had been in the King Keg for 4 days, seemed very sweet with no bitterness. Maybe the priming sugar hadn't all been eaten up by then.

Today though, 2 weeks after it was kegged, its perfect.

Ah yes, well I'm not "drinking it" yet you understand, just checking it.

My beer rota is in a bit of a hiatus at the moment, I've got 2 fresh brews in the barrels now (another went in today), a 3rd in the FV which will be ready for secondary or barrelling in a week, but nothing on tap as my other barrel was emptied last night.

Might end up drinking one of the two barreled ones after 10 days or so, simply because I need to liberate barrel space! If I don't get the rythym going right again I'll end up with another dead period like at the moment.

[Northern Brewer]

My beer rota is in a bit of a hiatus at the moment, I've got 2 fresh brews in the barrels now (another went in today), a 3rd in the FV which will be ready for secondary or barrelling in a week, but nothing on tap as my other barrel was emptied last night.

Might end up drinking one of the two barreled ones after 10 days or so, simply because I need to liberate barrel space! If I don't get the rythym going right again I'll end up with another dead period like at the moment.

How we suffer for our cause

[hoppingMad]

- would lowering the mash temp to say about 64 degrees make the beer a little drier and a little less sweet?

yes.
Other things you can do for a drier beer which involve acheiving a lower FG would be: mash well and long, I find a 2 hour mash can give a slightly more fermentable wort, replace a portion of malt with sugar, use a more attenuative yeast, proper pitching rate(not usually an issue with dried yeast), a step mash instead of a single infusion, a lower OG, using a yeast nutrient ( usually done in lagers and high gravity beers), using less crystal malts/cara malts and/or dextrine malts.