Kit adaption, DME or LME

[RichardG]

Given all that's been said, as it doesn't seem to make any difference to the end result, I think I'll go with the DME simply because it seems to be more manageable and I'm going to be adding hops/grains anyway. One question about the grains; I understand that I can get specialist grains that have been pre-mashed and only need steeping for 20mins or so to release the sugars. But, do these grains also come unsteeped? I ask because, if they do, I'll have to be careful to specify mashed grains when purchasing. I'm thinking of 1.5kg light DME and thought of adding some crystal (maybe some 250g or so?).

[sparky Paul]

Crystal, Chocolate, Black, Carapils and Roasted Barley are okay to use.

It's the process these grains go through which converts the starches into sugar, so any of these are suitable for steeping - you don't have to specify any special type - just get crushed, and away you go.

[RichardG]

Thanks for that SP, very informative. BTW, is it me, or has your post changed since I read it, and started writting my reply?

[sparky Paul]

Thanks for that SP, very informative. BTW, is it me, or has your post changed since I read it, and started writting my reply?

No you're not seeing things.

I'm still suffering with a cold in the head, and sometimes I lose track of what I'm doing. I thought I was on an extract brew thread, so started going off on an extract brew rant, whilst very interesting was completely off topic... so I deleted the last bit...

That's the second time I've done that in this thread. I should give up...

[RichardG]

Phew! Thought I was starting to lose my grip on reality! However, please don't give up; I've found all your input very useful. It's just the sort of thing I need.

[THE EMBALMER]

Badger Golden Glory - 25 litres

Badger Golden Glory

Ingredients
25L, 90min mash, 90min boil, 77% efficiency
Amount Item Type % or IBU
4.95 kg Pale Malt (2 Row) UK (5.0 EBC) Grain 97.06 % (substitute 3.8kg pale malt extract)
0.15 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (78.8 EBC) Grain 2.94 %
75.00 gm Fuggles [4.50 %] (90 min) Hops 32.5 IBU
20.00 gm Challenger [6.40 %] (10 min) Hops 4.2 IBU
15.00 gm Challenger [6.40 %] (0 min) Hops -
15.00 gm Elderflower (Dried) (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile
Measured Original Gravity: 1.047 SG
Measured Final Gravity: 1.011 SG
Actual Alcohol by Vol: 4.69 %
Bitterness: 36.6 IBU
Est Color: 10.3 EBC

[RichardG]

Quick question; you'll see from the proceeding posts that I'm planning to adapt a Coopers kit by steeping some Crystal and boiling some hops with further hop steepings for flavour and aroma. However, I'm not really clear as to the volume of liquid I should steep and / or boil. Can anyone advise?

[sparky Paul]

Quick question; you'll see from the proceeding posts that I'm planning to adapt a Coopers kit by steeping some Crystal and boiling some hops with further hop steepings for flavour and aroma. However, I'm not really clear as to the volume of liquid I should steep and / or boil. Can anyone advise?

2 to 3 litres always works for me... pour the extract from the can, then fill with boiling water, stir about to dissolve any remaining extract, pour into a pan and repeat so you have two can fulls. I use this to boil/steep the hops in.

If you wish to steep grains in the same liquor, adjust the temperature to around 70°C, and remove the grains before any boiling.

I find steeping the grains separately easier, and it seems to work fine, but you do need to boil the hops with some extract - the can rinsings do the job perfectly.

[RichardG]

Many thanks SP. It seems all I need now is a suitable thermometer so I can keep an idea on the temperature. Once I have that, I'm away! After that it'll be proper extract brewing, then (once I've be able to garner all the equipment) AG. Phew, I can see it's gonna be an interesting ride!

[RichardG]

So, today I had my brew day, experimenting for the first time with adapting a kit. Probably went some what over the top, but in the end, I couldn't help it! For the record my recipe (I use the term losely! ) was based on a Coopers Draught kit with additions as follows;

200g crushed Crystal steeped for 30 mins (used a muslin grain bag to hold them),
15g Challenger boiled for 40mins,
20g Goldings added to boil after 20mins,
15g dried Elderflowers also added 20mins into the boil,
15g Goldings added at the end of the boil and steeped for 20mins,
1kg light DME,
1 pkt Safale S-04 rehydrated.

In terms of experience of the process, it's interesting how much water you lose during the boil. I had to do a pretty big top-up after 20mins, and of course my water was cold. Net result, I had to bring the whole lot back to the boil before adding the Goldings. Next time I had a pan of water already hot ready to hand. That solved the problem next time I needed to add water. The steep was interesting as I'd got myself an inexpensive digital thermometer for £10. Hand held, you stick the end in the brew and it gives you a read out. Fine for what I was doing. I kept the temperature between 63.5 - 66 degrees except for a couple of occassions when reheating sent the temp a bit high; it got to just over 70 degrees at one point but I'm not to concerned about that. Need to be aware that the thermometer takes a few moments to catch up with the water temperature when heating.

I suspect this will have a BIG hop profile, but if so, I like that. Either way, I'm sure it'll be drinkable. What was very noticeable though was the fantastic aroma throughout. Heavenly! I would guess that was either the Goldings, or Elderflowers, or both, but if the end result is half as good as the smell, it'll be fine. Let the journey to the Dark Side begin!

[RichardG]

Okay, so it's been 7 days now, and I have avoided temptation and not taken any hydro readings until today. I used S-04 which as many of you will know, has something of a reputation as a fast fermenter. To be honest it had looked like it was all over some days back! So, the reading was 1010 which gives an ABV of 4.4% which is very satisfying. I tasted the testing beer (as you do) and am very pleased with the results even though it's pre-conditioning. Bitterness was ideal for my taste, though next time I think I'd up the flavour/aroma hops as I'd prefer a bit more. But we'll see how it matures.

As for bottling, it appears ready, however circumstances mean that I may not be able to bottle until Monday. Personally though, I don't think it'll do any harm and may ensure no off flavours from early bottling. We'll see!

[sparky Paul]

I bottled a Coopers Draught back in November, with only a Progress hop addition, some boiled and some steeped. I wasn't very impressed with it back then, I found it quite bland and wishy-washy, and I think I mentioned on one of the threads that I was disappointed with it.

However, I have to say now that I take it all back. I've just finished supping the last bottles, and it's turned out to be a very nice light ale indeed - a couple of months in the bottle has made big changes in the flavour.

[RichardG]

Well, for various reasons it was only yesterday that I was able to bottle this. I was somewhat concerned that there wouldn't be enough yeast in suspension for proper bottle conditioning, but in moving the FV from the under-stairs cupboard to the kitchen the brew was sufficiently agitated to raise sediment and yeast back into the brew. I bottled using 75g of caster sugar direct to a bottling bucket and then to bottles. FG remained at 1010. As one does I tried the test sample, and I'm very pleased with results so far. Much better than any plain kit I've done. May have slightly over done the bittering (have to remember the Coopers can is already hopped!), but much better hop flavour and aroma, especially when one remembers that this is straight from the FV! So it's off to at least 4 weeks conditioning now and I'm really looking forward to the end result and will leave a post to let you know how it ended up. As a process it's one I'd heartily recommend to everyone; I'd say the results fully justify the small extra effort as well as being very satisfying. Go for it!

[sparky Paul]

May have slightly over done the bittering (have to remember the Coopers can is already hopped!), but much better hop flavour and aroma, especially when one remembers that this is straight from the FV! So it's off to at least 4 weeks conditioning now and I'm really looking forward to the end result

You may well find that a good period of conditioning will soften that bitter edge considerably, and the hop and malt flavours will come through more. 4 weeks will improve the beer no end, but a couple of months and it will be at its best.

[RichardG]

Absolutely SP, good point well made. That's one reason I'm determined not to touch it for at least 4 weeks. When I crack the first one I want it to be ready so as to avoid any disappointment. By the time I get to the last it should of had a couple of months conditioning, so it'll be interesting to see the difference.