AG Is it expensive for ingredients

[escapizm]

HI

I’m some way of I think from all grain yet, I will try extract after a few more (increasing in quality) kits first. However..

My LHB shop suggested Id be as good to go to the off licence as go all grain due to the cost, he went on to say bad harvests have pushed grain costs up drastically.

That said it’s not the most affluent area and perhaps looked at me as a "cheap drink maker" rather than budding craft brewer.

As an average what would it cost (equipment aside) for the consumable ingredients for e.g. an IPA?

I’ve perused lots of the forum and cant wait to get making my own kit, the CFC alone looks great!!!

Thanks

escapizm

[DarloDave]

Thats ridiculous, AG is so much cheaper. for about 40 bottles of decent beer in the offl license going on a price of 1.50 a bottle £60.00.

AG prices, for around 5.5-6% beer. Malt cost around 7-8 quid from hop and grape (although you could get it much cheaper elsewhere, such as a local microbrewery). Plus a packet of hops for around a fiver...Whirlflock tablet around 20p...Yeast, about a quid. Works out about 15 quid in total..you could add another pound or so on things like bottle caps, but thats about it. Your LHBS is talking bollocks.

[steve_flack]

Let me guess. Your local HBS sells a lot of kits but very little (if any) AG stuff.....

[Horden Hillbilly]

Your LHBS is talking bollocks.

Couldn't agree more. Yes, you can spend a few bob when you first start ag brewing & get your boiler/cooler/mash tun, etc, but it soon pays for itself after a couple of brews.

[Robdog]

My LHBS said the same to me when i mentioned AG lol. TBH i find it cheaper than kits just about and the difference in quality makes it well worth while.

Initial outlay isnt cheap especially if like me you go the HLT, Boiler, IC etc etc plus then i bought Cornies but you can do it alot cheaper than i have.

I think mine works out at about 33-35p a pint but thats not factoring in electric or water costs but still way way cheaper than any Offie ive ever been to plus the fact its some if not the best beer ive ever tried and a decent hobby to boot which keeps me out of the pub.

I used to spend well over 100 quid a week down the boozer and now i hardly go out.

[softlad]

My LHBS told me not to bother with AG as he said it wasnt any better than kits. Now that I've ignored his advice he will agree that AG is streets ahead of any kit.

He's not getting my grain business as its all pre-packed youngs at silly prices.

It seems to be a common trait for HB shops to try to retain kit brewers due to their higher turnover in kit beers.

[escapizm]

Thanks for feedback, gonna bottle this weekend and put next kit on with few basic "quality tweeks" ie DME, camden tablets and drop into 2nd FV for ease of priming. Im doing/did real basic technique this time around and hope to improve with each batch.

I look forward to the process too, could be considerred as a nerd engineer but cant wait to get my "plant" up and running.

[Russ]

As everyone else has said

Ignore the guy at the HBS! hes talking Shite!! , the ingredients for all grain cheaper than the kits , if you buy sensibly (ie. not from him) Your results will be loads better too!

I've done kits, then extract now onto AG, if you've got the time (only downside to AG and lts worth it ) go AG you will not regret it

[clogwog]

All Grain is not cheaper than kit brewing, no matter what anyone says.

Firstly, there's the capital cost of setting up your brewery. Admittedly, in time, you will amortise that, and with every brew the input of your capital costs will decrease.

Ignoring that, let's compare the cost of a Kit & Kilo to an All Grain brew. This is in Aus $, but the principal is the same in £st.

1. Kit $12, Dry malt 1 kg $10. Energy cost to heat malt, say $0.20. If you use the kit yeast, and nothing else, the Total Cost = $22.20
Now, obviously, if you upgrade to brewing Kit & Bits, or better yeast such as Saf or Muntons, then the costs rise.

2. AG. 5 kg of grains $20, Hops $9, Liquid Yeast $3 ($15 pack split into 5 starters), Propane $4, Water Chemicals $too small to measure,Total Cost $36.00

None of this counts the cost of sanitiser etc etc, of which we probably use more in our AG gear. Nor does it count the cost of time.

Is AG beer 36/22.2 better than K&K? You betcha.
Is it cheaper than commercially purchased beer? Definitely.
Would I ever go back and brewing K&K? Not in a thousand years!

[Jim]

All Grain is not cheaper than kit brewing, no matter what anyone says.

Firstly, there's the capital cost of setting up your brewery. Admittedly, in time, you will amortise that, and with every brew the input of your capital costs will decrease.

Ignoring that, let's compare the cost of a Kit & Kilo to an All Grain brew. This is in Aus $, but the principal is the same in £st.

1. Kit $12, Dry malt 1 kg $10. Energy cost to heat malt, say $0.20. If you use the kit yeast, and nothing else, the Total Cost = $22.20
Now, obviously, if you upgrade to brewing Kit & Bits, or better yeast such as Saf or Muntons, then the costs rise.

2. AG. 5 kg of grains $20, Hops $9, Liquid Yeast $3 ($15 pack split into 5 starters), Propane $4, Water Chemicals $too small to measure,Total Cost $36.00

None of this counts the cost of sanitiser etc etc, of which we probably use more in our AG gear. Nor does it count the cost of time.

Is AG beer 36/22.2 better than K&K? You betcha.
Is it cheaper than commercially purchased beer? Definitely.
Would I ever go back and brewing K&K? Not in a thousand years!

Maybe costs are different in Oz, clogwog. A decent quality 2 can kit here will set you back up to £20, whereas 5kg of Malt will be less than £7, and sufficient hops for 5 gal about £3 or £4, with maybe £1 for the yeast.

Yes, you can get cheap kits for just over a tenner, but you have to add sugar or spraymalt. A quality kit is more expensive than all grain ingredients. The hit comes when you have to buy AG equipment.

[John F]

I've worked out that my AG beers cost between 25 and 30p a (500ml) bottle, apart from my Imperial Russian Stout which is about 46p a bottle. I haven't factored in my equipment, but as that was paid for several years ago I don't consider it as part of my costing.

[Jim]

........ If you can't see yourself finding 5-6hrs spare every month for the next 2 years and beyond then i'd say Clogwog is right, kits are cheaper.

Clogwog's calcs are showing grain is more expensive than kits based on ingredients alone, which I don't agree with.

I do agree that you can spend a fortune on gear, but some of that is common to any kind of brewing (cornies &gas, bottling equipment, fermenters etc). And a mash tun and boiler (and probably a chiller) are the only additional bits of equipment that you must have to do AG.

[delboy]

Surely if you are factoring in the cost of the equipment then that cost should be factored in over the typical lifetime of the equipment which is longer than two years.
How old was that boiler of Jims

[Jim]

Surely if you are factoring in the cost of the equipment then that cost should be factored in over the typical lifetime of the equipment which is longer than two years.
How old was that boiler of Jims

The point of off setting the cost of equipment over a relatively short period of time is that homebrewing, like any hobby, with the best will in the world often turns out to be a just passing fad and gets left by the way side as kids, wives or life in general start to take priority.

If you plan for it as such then you have the true cost of brewing a pint from the outset. If after a couple of years it becomes part of your lifestyle, at that point you can consider the cost of your beer to be just the cost of the ingredients alone, but if you try to off set the cost over a lifetime of brewing, in the majority of cases the equipment will never pay for itself (compared to brewing with kits).

Homebrewers come and go and not everyone can aford to loose 5-6hrs a month on making beer alone.

While I agree with everything you're saying, the original question was purely about ingredients.

[Garth]

not everyone can aford to loose 5-6hrs a month on making beer alone.

That's an odd way of looking at it, I certainly don't think I'm losing anything when I make beer, I would class it as good use of time doing something I thoroughly enjoy,

if you class it as a loss you've got the wrong hobby/pastime/leisure time pursuit whatever you want to call it.