Question About GW recipe's

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NickP

Question About GW recipe's

Post by NickP » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:30 pm

Hi

Firstly can i say this is not a criticism, but i have a copy of GW's BYBRA and after doing a couple of AG brews (my only two in fact) i have just noticed that all of the mashing temperatures are the same :?: After reading the intial descriptions i.e fruity dry etc im not sure how this is achieved as some homebrew books say the temperature has a lot to do with the malty / dry character of the beer. Have i misunderstood this :?:

escapizm

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by escapizm » Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:22 pm

You are correct that taste can be altered with differing mash temp and I think GW covers that in his book, the bulk of the flavours described are derived from the hops etc.

I suspect you could when more experienced make changes yourself but IMHO to cover that in the text of the book may be a little too overwhelming for the reader as its hard enough to get repeatability given the 66 deg C let alone keep changing by 1 or 2 degrees to suit a specific recipe. Good book though I’ve yet to make anything "exactly" from it... :)

NickP

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by NickP » Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:46 pm

Like i said i have made 2 from this book and recomend it, the two brews i have made have been really close to the comercial stuff it has impressed my friends and family, and all this from a new brewer so i dont think you can go far wrong. The question was really to help my understanding of the whole process :!: I learn more by trying / failing than getting it exactly right, which is lucky as i tend to fail at most things :lol:

chris_reboot

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by chris_reboot » Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:28 am

for the recipes as they are (i.e. no lagers) then I don't see it as a problem.
It gives me a consistency to aim for.
As I get more experienced, I can experiment with that more if I wish.

I think GW was aiming middle of the road, so following the advice, you should get good results.
tweaking here and there might yield better efficiencies perhaps, but I've no complaints! :)

boingy

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by boingy » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:05 am

I concur that GW's book is tryng to avoid complicating things too much and that is to be applauded I think. More experienced brewers will use the recipes as a starting point and I think many of us cannot resist tweaking the recipes a tad.

Nick, if you want to get more into the theory and detail of brewing I can recommend Palmer's "How To Brew" and if you want to go still further then something like Daniel's "Designing Great Beers" will give you way too much detail about everything. This latter book is a step too far for me though!

NickP

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by NickP » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:17 am

boingy wrote: Nick, if you want to get more into the theory and detail of brewing I can recommend Palmer's "How To Brew" and if you want to go still further then something like Daniel's "Designing Great Beers" will give you way too much detail about everything. This latter book is a step too far for me though!
Thanks boingy, i have palmers "how to brew" book and perhaps that is where i am going wrong, looking to much at the detail without any real practical experiance :oops: , but i may go for Daniels "Designing Great Beers" as it nearly that time and everyone asking what they can buy, may make for some interesting bedtime reading....i have always been an isomniac :lol:

chris_reboot

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by chris_reboot » Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:03 am

read around certainly, I've read loads on here, GW's book, two of Dave Lines, but experience counts for a lot.
I've found that whilst the textbooks are great for background info, I'm at the stage now where I am tweaking things here and there. My first couple of brews were just see if it works(!) so following GW's recipes have been very useful without being overly complex for a newbie. Consistent mash and boil times mean you shouldn't go far wrong. It's one less complication when starting out.

NickP

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by NickP » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:59 pm

Ok took the plunge and brought daniels "Designing Great Beers", i will continue to brew the beers from GW BYOBRA whilst reading the new one, i like nearly all of the beers in GW BYOBRA i really enjoy most british beers, i suffer from needing to know exactly whats going on with things its the control freak in me.

Thanks guys for all your advice, my wife thinks it's great that you all encourage me :wink:

Graham

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by Graham » Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:30 pm

As others have already said, BYO has to be uncomplicated and easily accessible for the beginner. Much of the advice given in the book is the result of sticking as close as possible the basics.

However, one thing to beware of is that some authors give the impression that some limiting factor takes place by varying mash temperature (or pH); that the mash enzymes magically stop working when the sugar balance is correct. They don't. There is a time factor involved which many authors forget to mention.

All that happens when mash temperature is varied is that the two major enzymes work much faster at a high temperature than a low temperature. The enzymes do not get used up, nor do they stop working (unless the temperature is at destructively high levels), but will continue to work until the mash is deliberately stopped. Given enough time the alpha-amylase will convert all the starch into dextrin, and the beta-amylase will convert as much of the dextrin that it can into maltose - typically 62% of it. No matter what the temperature may be, the mash will get to the same point sooner or later, and will limit when about 62% of the total sugars are fermentable. This is the standard balance for almost all beers. The only way to alter this sugar balance is to forcibly stop the mash, early, by rapidly raising its temperature to about 76 degrees to arrest beta-amylase activity. Not only do home brewers not usually do this, but choosing the correct point to stop the mash is fraught with difficulty. How does one know when the mash is at the correct sugar balance? A degree or two difference in temperature or a small difference in pH will throw the timings wildly out. Jiggling with mash temperature and pH is ineffective without appropriate timing, and that is a risky strategy.

On here we sometimes see full-mashers ending up with what is called a stuck fermentation, but in my view this is down to attempts to cut down on mash time, which is also fairly common on here. This stuck fermentation is because the beta-amylase has not been given enough time to convert all the dextrin to maltose. In the book the mash time is standardised on 90 minutes. This is because if the mash temperature drops more than expected, or the pH is way out, there is still enough time for that magical 63% fermentability to be reached.

NickP

Re: Question About GW recipe's

Post by NickP » Thu Oct 22, 2009 8:26 am

Many thanks for the reply I feel somwhat honored. It's a difficult subject to get the hang off by just reading, it would be nice to be able to "see" into the mash to see it all in action, I think my questions stem from my ignorance of how other factors make up the overall quality of the beer, like fruitiness or dryness in a beer. I think im also ignorant of how IBU really relates to a beer, as you can taste some beers that have similar ibu's to others but the bitterness in my mouth seems far apart. Its a steep learning curve im trying to climb as you can appreciate, I'm greatfull that there are people llike yourself that are willing to share your knowledge of this subject.

Once again Thanks =D>

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