Bishops finger and Spitfire

[Deebee]

based on this thread i thought i would copy the main contents of the mail i received from the head brewer at Shepard and Neame in regard to these two brews.

There has always been the thought that Amber malt was used in these.

Norms real ale almanac also states this and although i know the recipe there is not far off the mark, this is what i received from S & N so thought i would share it with you all.

Please do not think me arrogant, but as we all like brewing beers that are as close to the original as we can, i thought i should let you know.

Here is the recipe for bishops finger

Colour 41
IBU 41
ABV 5.4%

Ingredients as a percentage by weight.

Pale malt 77% by weight
Crystal malt 12 % by weight
Malt Syrup 10% by weight

Hops ( which are target and goldings) 1% by weight

Spitfire is slightly different

Colour 41
IBU 41
ABV 5.4%

Ingredients as a percentage by weight.

Pale malt 76% by weight
Crystal malt 11 % by weight
Malt Syrup 12% by weight

Hops ( which are target and goldings) 1% by weight

The IBU is slightly less, the EBC is slightly less and the OG is also slighly less ( although i can't for the life of me find the figures.

Now unless they are telling me huge lies, there is no amber malt in the grist. Why they use malt sirup is beyond me, maybe it is cheaper for them to use this than upping the pale, maybe it is something that actually adds the special flavour these brews have.

I hope these are of use to some of you.

thanks

[Horden Hillbilly]

Thanks for sharing the info you received.

[RichardG]

What I find curious is that the recipes are virtually identical, and both have an ABV of 5.4% (typo?). I know that the ABV of both has come down over the years, but on draft I thought that Spitfire was 4.2% (or there abouts) and Bishops Finger was 5%. I believe the bottled versions may be stronger. Like deebee I'm also surprised by the use of malt syrup.

[flytact]

Malt syrup added by the brewer for homebrew purposes? Maybe he has greater efficiencies or a unique process that as a homebrewer we could only replicate by adding malt.
Just a stab...

[Graham]

The malt syrup will almost certainly be maltose-rich corn syrup. It is made from maize, not malt extract. It is a form of sugar used as a cheapener.

[delboy]

The malt syrup will almost certainly be maltose-rich corn syrup. It is made from maize, not malt extract. It is a form of sugar used as a cheapener.

What would be the best alternative for the homebrewer, plain sugar or something else?

[dave-o]

Dextrose, i'd say.

[Graham]

What would be the best alternative for the homebrewer, plain sugar or something else?

Corn syrup is available to brewers in glucose-rich and maltose-rich versions. I don't think that there are any dextrins to speak of in the maltose-rich version, and as both maltose and glucose are 100% fermentable, I would suggest that plain sugar is a fair substitute.

[Deebee]

What I find curious is that the recipes are virtually identical, and both have ABV of 5.4% (tyo?). I know that the ABV of both has come down over the years, but on draft I thought that Spitfire was 4.2% (or there abouts) and Bishops Finger was 5%. I believe the bottled versions may be strongerLike deebee I'm also surprised by the use of malt syrup.

↲Jepp, typo. Should have been 4.5.↲would substitute syrup for sugar be gram for gram?

[Graham]

would substitute syrup for sugar be gram for gram?

No. Difficult to know the % solids in the syrup without seeing the specs, but I would multiply the quantity of syrup by 0.82 to get the amount of granulated sugar to use.

[Deebee]

Gents,

i found the original mail i received from SN regarding these brews i was interested in.

I asked them if the grist of the Whitstable bay, BF and Spifire included Amber.

here is the reply.

"Although we have used amber malt before in our pilot brewery, our main
brewery only uses pale and crystal malt, therefore none of Whitstable
Bay, Bishops Finger or Spitfire use amber malt.

Laura Morris"

So there we have it.

Sugar is likely a small addition for us home brewer types.

Whos up for trying to make a clone?

[EccentricDyslexic]

So how about the hops then? 100g per 10kg grist? use target to bring the ibus up to spec then add the rest of the 100g in as late Goldings?

Steve

[aceuass]

Looking at the Spitfire clone to do next and on their site they say 3 different hops, I did find this
http://www.spitfireale.co.uk/spitfire-a ... notes.aspx
target, first gold and goldings
what would a good hop schedule be for this
Cheers
Paul