Views on steam sanatising?

[Cazamodo]

I see mixed reviews about people using steam to sanatise with.
I would like to buy a cheap steamer, and use it to sanatise my FV's and jerry cans to mature beer in. And also anything else I could sanatise it with.
Not saying I would give up starsan but steam if it works, seems easier.

Now I've read people use it and it works, then people saying it wont work, unless its under pressure. Now im hoping I could put the nozzle in a bung, put it on, and stick it in the top of the barrell/jerry can for a while...

Any one do this? Also, if I sat anything in the fermentor while I did this, would that be sanatised as well?

[Wolfy]

I've also read (more than a few people say) that they don't bother to sanitize their equipment or bottles and never have any problem - so I'd be careful of what you read people saying works or does not work.
As per Wiki here ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sterilizat ... robiology) ) and here ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moist_heat_sterilization ) moist heat, steam and boiling can and does destroy micro-organisms, however typically that is steam under pressure (such as in an autoclave or pressure cooker) or boiling for an extended period (15-30mins).
With adequate time and contact I presume that a steamer would do an adequate job of sanitizing brewing equipment, however, it may not be as simple/quick as just shoving the steam in, may need extended contact time, and it may not be any easier than using StarSan (which is not that difficult after all).

[adomant]

don't try to pressurise the steam in the jerrycan yourself by putting the nozzle in the bung hole, that could go horribly wrong.

people sometimes get confused between sanitisation and sterilization. sterilization involves autoclaves, pressure cookers, gamma radiation, prolonged heat contact etc... you can sanitise with steam, so long as the steamer can deliver the temperature and quantity. one technique is to turn the vessel upside down and get the steam in from below for 15 minutes - the steam must also be able to escape from below

if you can find a way to leave it unattended, otherwise you will get fed up holding it. less time might still work

[Cully]

Steam from a hand steamer or one of those wallpaper steamer types with extra nozzles is fine, but you HAVE to clean the vessel thouroughly before hand. For example, I clean my fvs with hot soapy water and rinse them well after use. I steam them before the next brew goes in and then spray videne inside in a non-rinse solution. I wouldnt trust the steam as an only means, its just become part of my processif you see what I mean. I have done that for the last 4 or 5 brews and not had an infection, though to be fair, same process without the steam for the previous 15 or so and no infections there, either. The one thing I will say, no mater how scrupulously I cleaned them, the fv's always went back to smelling a little of beer. The steamer removes that smell, so it must be doing something.

[boingy]

You may also need to think about the materials you are steam cleaning. Some plastics will not like sustained exposure to steam and some glass may not cope with the thermal shock.

I can't really see the attraction of steam myself. Chemical sanitisation works just fine and is less hassle.

[Kev888]

I've heard there are some benefits in using steam like this, where there are scratches or crudd that can't be removed - heating them up rather than hoping chemicals penetrate them. I looked into it for my conical FV, but didn't find anything very conclusive about time/effectiveness and (as wolfy says) look hard enough and you'll find someone willing to claim almost anything. I know it is used in some breweries for cleaning, but i don't know if thats physical steam cleaning or microbiological cleaning.

I think it mostly comes down to temperature though; not being pressurised the steam won't be all that hot (compared to autoclaving) but it should be hot enough to work on most things if you sustain it long enough, and whilst not dry as such its not got quite the heat capacity of boiling water so it will need more time. IIRC my wallpaper stripper can generate steam for about an hour before it runs dry, so its not out of the question.

IIRC the minibrew manufacturers suggest boiling water poured down the sides of their plastic FVs if they get scratched, but again that exposes my ignorance as I thought it took much longer to be especially effective.

Cheers
kev

[Deller12]

Chaps,

This is a good video to watch this guy steams a coniacl with out an issue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=du8KXg-jZfw

Lee

[Ditch]

For what it's worth; I've very recently got hold of a (Far from cheap!) Bissel 'Power' Steam Cleaner. About £50.00's worth
I actually got it on the understanding that it will help clean my used and dirty equipment (Matron!)

I especially had the inner rims of FV lids in mind. Sh!t gets in there during the Spew. I have nightmares getting it out of those tight, deep cracks (I'm on a roll with this one )

Anyway; Hardly had need to use it just yet. Because my FV's are largely in use. But, messing about with it, experimenting about the cottage? Hell, yeah! This baby could melt skid marks out of denim! Mine'll pay for itself, regardless then

But, yeah. My point is: I bleach and hose out my gear. Steamer's just to melt away the stubborn crud beforehand. Using it to Sanitise never crossed my mind.

[Cazamodo]

i'm still tempted to get hold of a cheap steam cleaner. i was thinking the other day if I could find one and fit a liquid out post to it I could use it to clean my beer lines. thats if its even possible

[Cazamodo]

i'm still tempted to get hold of a cheap steam cleaner. i was thinking the other day if I could find one and fit a liquid out post to it I could use it to clean my beer lines. thats if its even possible

[PaddyX21]

I've got one of the handheld steam cleaners, Vax one I think, and as Ditch says it's great for getting into nooks and crannies etc.
Not too sure about using it for general sanitising though...
Small and or fiddly areas would be best imho

[Ditch]

Agreed, Pads. Plus, anyway; I just don't relish the thought of having my hand inside the enclosure of a five gallon bucket, with all that scalding hot steam belching everywhere.

No one in their right mind would reach through the steam jet issuing from a boiling kettle. This is a comparable situation.

No. I keep the damn thing away from myself and concentrate.


Cazamodo; I imagine, if ye can devise a safe connection? It might work. Of course, having hot steam hissing out the other end is what ye'd be looking for. No good if it cools halfway through.

Dunno. Again; I roll my plastic pipes up and thrust them into a bucket of bleach solution. 'Drown' them till the bubbles stop. Later, I flush them out with running water from the tap.

Steam's a handy tool. It's Not the answer to every problem we can conceive though.

[Deller12]

Well added a quick disconnect to the wallpaper stripper and now steaming the corni kegs. I give them a good clean 1st and then steam them for 15 mins job done.

[robbarwell]

I have started turning the FVs upside down over the boiling wort for 30 mins with the valve open. Clouds of steam come out of the valve. Not had a problem so far.

Big brewery here uses steam for sanitizing casks

[Newt Dundee]

It's interesting to see this thread come up again just as I was about to ask the question.

I've already cleaned and sterilised my bottles thoroughly, but then decided to delay bottling as I was being a little premature. So far my brew has been in the FV for 15 days and my bottles have been cleaned, sterilised and then unfortunately sat for five days.

I've just had cause to get the wallpaper steamer out, and suddenly thought, if I take the paddle off, the hose can quite happily inject steam into a bottle whilst inverted. Obviously kitchen gloves at the ready for this one.

Does anyone have any opinions on this, either as a good or bad idea?

I can see clearing 45 bottles off without a problem just prior to bottling. My biggest problem being space to soak and rinse all of them at the same time.