Identifying my problem...

[9squirrels]

I've had a consistently harsh aftertaste in pretty much all of my beers for the last year or so. They're just about OK if I go heavy on the late/dry hops, but some have been completely undrinkable. I posted about this before and the consensus seemed to be that my ultra-soft water was to blame.

Since then however, I've tried pretty much every combination of water treatment imaginable (mainly using GW's calculator on here, but I've had a go with John Palmer's spreadsheet version too), and I'm still getting the same after-taste. Water treatment does improve the problem slightly, but not enough. So I'm thinking there must be something else going wrong...

I've tried switching HLT, boiler, mash tun, fermenter, and pretty much every other bit of equipment I can think of, so I don't think that's the problem. I clean with oxy and sanitise with StarSan, like many others on here, so I think I'm OK on that score too.

Unless I'm missing something, all that really leaves is sparging or maybe something airborne.
I usually mash in with 2.5L per kg of grain around 66, mash for 60-90 mins, add water to mash out at around 75 (although it usually ends up slightly lower than that, at 72-72ish), drain, and then add the next batch at 75.
I brew in my basement with the back door open. It's far from spotless, but there's nothing obviously any worse than some of the commercial breweries I've visited. A bit damp maybe.

Can anyone offer any suggestions?
Starting to tear my hair out...

[far9410]

Where do you keep your grains, are they getting damp/stale?, or maybe picking up a taste off the container, just a thought!

[9squirrels]

Cheers for the reply.
I do keep my grain in the basement, which is slightly damp, so that could be the problem. I use the blue mango-chutney style plastic barrels though, with clamp-seal lids, so they should be airtight... I'm not sure how long it would take for grain to get damp or go stale. All the malt in my latest batch was delivered within the last three weeks.

[bigrichlock]

Harsh aftertaste, do you mean like sucking on a used tea bag tannin sort of taste? do you use a pH meter? any idea what ur mash and last runnings pH's are? and for that manner the pH of your final beer?

Rich

[seymour]

What about your fermentation temperatures? If it gets too warm, the yeast produces hot, harsh, solventy fusel alcohols.

Skim through this BJCP list of faults, and let us know if any of the descriptions sound familiar.

[pumblechook]

What about your fermentation temperatures? If it gets too warm, the yeast produces hot, harsh, solventy fusel alcohols.

Skim through this BJCP list of faults, and let us know if any of the descriptions sound familiar.

Useful list....

[boingy]

It's weird that the problem started about a year ago and has remained. I'm not one to rush to blame water (blaming water seems to be a trendy right now...) but maybe your water supply has been switched to a different source.

It's really easy to overdo water treatments so my suggestion would be to do a brew using supermarket bottled water. Others will be able to advise the best brand but that will allow you to home in on the problem and won't cost a great deal.

[gnutz2]

Have you tried making a batch with bottled water?

[Dr. Dextrin]

I'd check the mash pH or you'll never really know if your water treatment is doing anything useful.

[dedken]

Another thing to try is to make up a beer kit which will eliminate all other parts of your process.

[9squirrels]

From that list, I guess astringency is probably the closest description. There's no graininess, but "lingering harshness" sounds about right.
A change of water sources does seem to be the most likely answer, I agree. Especially as the problem seemed to start around the time we had that really dry spell last spring. Before then, my beers were always fine. Pale ales at least (I know my water isn't suitable for darker beers without treatment).
I did think about doing a batch with bottled water. Anyone know if the Tesco Ashbeck stuff would be any good?

Based ph strips, for what they're worth, my last few mashes have been around the 5.4 mark.
What sort of ph should the final beer be? Never thought of testing that.

Doing a beer kit is a brilliant idea! I'm definitely going to do that.

[bigrichlock]

I would never believe pH strips, the only certain way to know if it is related to tannin extraction is to measure the pH of the last running's with a good quality pH meter, if its up near or above 6 then that is quite possibly the answer.

If the pH of your mash is 5.4 ish then something else wort trying is acidifying the sparge water, but again you are flying blind with out a pH meter.

pH of the final beer is dependent on style but should be low 4's as a ball park.

Brewing a kit or using bottled water is an good idea but its not going to address the problem, there not cheep but hop and grape do a good pH meter for 80 quid its well worth it in my opinion.

Rich

[yojimbo]

Is any one else drinking your beer and tasting the same problem.

[9squirrels]

I've binned the worst offending batches without offering them to anyone. Of the others, my wife says she can taste the same off-flavour, but to a lesser extent. In some, she's actually said she can't taste it at all. Other friends have tried and loved batches that I think are pretty harsh. But then, they might just be being polite (although that didn't stop them almost draining an entire keg of the stuff one night recently!)

Interesting point though. I wonder if it might be something personal...?
I have found myself returning the odd beer even in pubs recently.

[yojimbo]

Are you a smoker and stopped smoking I stopped smoking for nearly 3 weeks and things tasted odd to me food beer not right chocolate tasted yuk too. Could you post some recipe up so we can see what your using.