Ecofass Kegs

[och29]

Beer bottle caps are made of metal and are impermeable to oxygen. Even if they weren't, their surface area is tiny compared to the surface of a plastic bag. I think I'll take your 'bottom line' with a pinch of salt.

Actually I was thinking about the seal between bottle and the cap.

[bobsbeer]

Update as of 5/8

Total requested:
Bobsbeer - 3
Pinto - 2
och29 - 4
Buster - 2
Oilyb - 1
Ceejay - 2
Poggytyke - 2

Available 16

Come on guys get your names down then we can get this off the ground. So far we have half a pallet spoken for so we are getting there.

[bobsbeer]

Update as of 5/8

Total requested:
Bobsbeer - 3
Pinto - 2
och29 - 4
Buster - 2
Oilyb - 1
Ceejay - 2
Poggytyke - 2
Moonlighter- 3


Available 13

We are now over 50% ordered. So if you are interested please let me know ASAP so we can get this up and running.

[bobsbeer]

Just bumping this thread to see if there is anymore interest. I guess if not the idea can be scrapped, which is a shame as the kegs are really good.

[barneey]

It would be a shame if you cant make it happen, although everything on the keg front has gone quiet recently?

[Gandolf]

Hi Guys

Has this thread ended? Would really like to know with regard to Beer Engines.

I dispense through KK but now have a couple of Beer Engines and looking at ways to use them.

Was thinking of Polypins but Ecofass look more adaptable if they work.

G

[stevetk189]

Hi guys, uber long time since I posted here but I've been using Ecofass new generations kegs since the middle of last year and i am pretty chuffed with them.

They're light, simple to use, the replacement bags are cheap - opt for the built in valve type rather than the re-usable as the minor price difference isn't worth the farting about cleaning out the valve.

I'm still getting around to trying one with a beer engine but I've been force carbing and refermenting in the keg with so-far, success.

Oops, almost forgot. Happy new year to you all.

As these kegs have no spear any sediment stays well away from the dispense end of things ie the bottom of the bag so as long as you don't go shaking the keg around 10 minutes before service, you get nice bottled conditioned in a keg, clear beer.

To force carbonate I do the following.

Fit the bag.

My filling head has a valve on the beer in (the beer out when used to serve) and a valve on the co2 in so, with the beer out/in valve closed i pressurise the keg to 1 bar.

Slowly open the beer out/in valve and the pressure squeezes the empty bag to force any air out. Once you hear the crinkling plastic sounds stop close both valves and uncouple the keg keeping it at 1 bar pressure.

Connect the filling head to the beer tank and let the beer flow to fill the line and head. yep you'll spill a bit but it's better than the line full of air going into the bag you just carefully purged.

Connect the beer line to the filling head "beer in" and disconnect the co2 line then fit the head to the keg, keeping both valves closed. Give everything with spilled beer on it a rinse off and star san spray if you like.

Turn the keg upside down and stand it on a couple of empty kegs or crates, whatever - just as long as you can still get at the two valves.

First time I did this I opened the beer in valve and expected that as I opened the co2 valve the Co2 pressure would begin to drop and as pressures equalized, the beer would flow into the keg. What actually happened was there was a little trapped air - there's always going to be a tiny bit in the head - which was rapidly forced up into my (gravity) filling tank - bubble and splash!

So, what i do now is before opening the beer in valve, i crack open the co2 valve and as the pressure drops, slowly open the beer valve watching for signs of blowback.

Once the keg is filled. Beer valve closed and turn the keg the right way up. Sometimes the last couple of litres won't flow into the keg, in that case carefully and slowly turn the keg the right way up and by the time it's upright, the last 2 litres have gone in.

Refit the co2 line to the co2 valve and - in my case so far it's worked - put 2.5 bar back pressure in the keg. The plastic keg bodies are only rated to 3bar max.

Then I attach the co2 line to the beer in valve, check the gauge is still 2.5 or a tad higher, and slowly open the valve to begin forcing the co2 into the beer-filled bag. Shake the keg a few times during the next 24 hours.

Disconnect.

Fit the serving head and off you go, if you want it fizzier, carb for longer.

I tend to have my beer at 2 to 6 degrees C when filling and keep the keg at that temp during the carbonation time.

I think that about covers it. I'm still experimenting but so far that approach has produced nicely carbonated beers.

[Druncan]

@stevetk189, Interested in hearing how you are getting on with the Ecofass kegs? any problems? looking at this route to expand my microbrewery set up.

[chris2012]

Have you also looked at key kegs, they seem to work on the same principle.

I got one a while ago, I had to use a special coupler though, not sure if ecofass kegs use a sankey style coupler or not.

[Druncan]

Hi Chris2012,
I have several key kegs from neighbouring breweries. They work OK, but the recycling and dismantling is putting me off. Also used ecokegs, but the big ball inside is not currently re-cyclable.

The Ecofass inners are though and 3 months BB date would be fine for me. I am limited on water for sanitising loads of kegs that is another reason I'm getting some. I have a sadly ever-growing range of couplers,,,,,,

[stevetk189]

@stevetk189, Interested in hearing how you are getting on with the Ecofass kegs? any problems? looking at this route to expand my microbrewery set up.

Ooops, sorry for the delay, I got tied up with the addition of a small distillery to my brewery and that coupled with some bad back, shoulders beer ended up taking a rest for a few years. I'm in the process of relaunching this year.

I'm still using ecofass, still pleased with them and prefer them to keykeg as the outer shells are re-suable, only the inner bag gets chucked. The bags are available either Type A or S, I use A.

Recently I've been filling them (and bottles and cans) ready carb'd from a 60l FermZilla and they're perfect. To the point I'm seriously considering a couple of unitanks and doing away with the refermentation in keg as a week or so in the warm etc is for me a pain in the bum and takes up space better used plus heating the conditioning room is an additional expense I'm happy to do away with.

[stevetk189]

Have you also looked at key kegs, they seem to work on the same principle.

I got one a while ago, I had to use a special coupler though, not sure if ecofass kegs use a sankey style coupler or not.

EcoFass use Sankey and Type A. I prefer them as the outer shells are re-usable and the replacement bags are a lot cheaper than a new KeyKeg each time, not to mention the KeyKeg specific head for filling and dispensing which then requires a KeyKeg specific cleaning socket.

[nallum]

No, definitely not. Plastic is not an ecological alternative to metal. I’m not entirely comfortable using plastic FVs and only use them when my stainless kegmenters are occupied. Plastic should be minimised in brewing. The fact is plastic is not food safe despite the claims - made with huge conflicts of interest - by, wait for it, plastic manufacturers and those increasing profits using plastic packaging. Researchers have been using mass spec to assess plastics for chemical composition. The results are actually alarming. Hundreds of chemicals that are not supposed to be there. Some known toxic compounds and many novel with unknown risks. The plastics industry and food packagers have no idea where all these additional compounds come from. Either they never assessed things properly or they’re liars profiteering at any cost. I’ve had my suspicions for several years and aim, where possible, to avoid plastic in my process, especially where long-term contact is involved, like a keg.

[nallum]

For those who might be interested:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.3c08250

My advice, if you’re young, especially a women of childbearing age, try to avoid plastic in the brewing process, especially where high temperatures are involved or where long-term contact with alcohol is likely. I’m not that young but it bothers me. Everyone else, just carry on as you see fit. Probably too late anyway.

[MarkA]

My advice, if you’re young, especially a women of childbearing age, try to avoid plastic in the brewing process, especially where high temperatures are involved or where long-term contact with alcohol is likely. I’m not that young but it bothers me. Everyone else, just carry on as you see fit. Probably too late anyway.

I agree. I've never been happy about plastic boilers even if they do say they are food safe etc and have always used a stainless steel boiler. I ferment in plastic, would prefer not to (but can't afford all stainless fermenters) and only long term store beer in glass bottles.