Skinners Brewery Tour

[Kegman]

I did the Skinners Brewery tour last week and have to say I thought it was excellent. Brilliant and very knowledgeable tour guide, friendly place but above all a free bar I was also offered some yeast but had to go before they could find the head brewer.

I've been trying to find out more about their methods as I've attempted to clone Betty Stogs (here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=51700) this is what I discovered.

The malt is ground by them then put into the mash tun at the same time as the water. It's mashed for 20 minutes at 90 degrees then fly sparged. It's then boiled for 1 hour 15 mins with bittering hops added after an hour. The wort is then transferred to a hop-back containing the aroma hops for 30 minutes, stirred for the last 10. Finally it's temperature is reduced to 18 degrees. I was also told that they dry-hop in the casks.

I couldn't find out which hops are used for which beers but these are the ones I saw:

Belma USA - (it was mentioned that it's used for Lushingtons)
Mount Hood USA
Willamette USA
Styrian Goldings (I think is in Betty Stogs but not 100% sure)
Citra USA
Fuggles
Northdown UK (I was told wasn't in Betty Stogs)
Target UK

I was also told that salt was added Betty Stogs.

Some interesting things here IMO, mashing for 20 minutes at 90 degrees and adding salt?

[Belter]

Haha sounds like the same tour guide my brother had. Bittering hops added after an hour haha.

This has made my day. Almost as much as when my brother came home and told me Steve Skinner had discovered The hop Citra and all hops were exactly the same just grown in different places. All beers were exactly the same. The only thing that differed was the yeast.

I know Supercooper has been on a brew day with them. Hopefully he can comment?

[jmc]

20 mins at 90 degrees?

Can't see that working.

[mozza]

Oh my, I think you should take that with (excuse the pun) a pinch of salt!

[orlando]

That tour guide must be trying to liven up his/her day, I really don't know whether to laugh or cry, you've been short changed kegman, I would want my money back, hang on, free bar you say , not such a bad joke I suppose.

It reminds me a little of an occasion when a friend and I were on a pub crawl in a city I had never been to before. A guy pulled up in his car and asked us for directions, my mate went into a quite detailed description of how to get there. This somewhat surprised me so I said "have you lived here before?", no, he replied with a hint of a wicked smile! I didn't really approve of that either.

[Supercooper]

The skinners process is not wildly different from any other brewery. But I can dispel a few myths for you.
They buy their malt ready crushed from tuckings
They do add salts ( it's called DWB) since the water is so soft. It's a blend of gypsum, Epsom and
They mash at 66 deg for 90 mins, then fly sparge with a rotating arm.
Boil for 90 mins. Hops at 90 and 60 mins.
Into the hop back with lots of hops for 20 minutes steep, then recirculated for 10 mins.
Then into plate chiller on way to fermenter ( also oxygenated with pure O2).
Massive yeast innoculation added ( not as a starter though, just yeast slurry)
Beer stays in primary for 5 to 7 days before racking off to conditioning tanks.
As far as I know, they don't dry hop.
Perhaps the tour guide had been in the free bar for a while prior to your tour?
Cheers

[Matt12398]

If it's the strange old looking guy with the beard that showed you around he actually doesn't know a whole lot about brewing but he knows enough not to spout complete nonsense.

[orlando]

If it's the strange old looking guy with the beard that showed you around he actually doesn't know a whole lot about brewing but he knows enough not to spout complete nonsense.

Can't be him then .

[Kegman]

It wasn't the old guy with a beard, this bloke was probably in his 50's. The dry-hop wasn't mentioned on the tour, 2 of the employees told me the at the bar afterwards.

I double-checked the mash and hop times with him as they took me by surprise too, but he was pretty positive which is why I took the time to share the information with you all.

At the risk of becoming more of a laughing stock, has anyone actually tried mashing for a shorter time at a higher temperature?

[orlando]

At the risk of becoming more of a laughing stock, has anyone actually tried mashing for a shorter time at a higher temperature?

As you know it's all about activating the enzymes Alpha Amylase and Beta Amylase at those temperatures you will completely destroy them. The reason for sparging at circa 80c is that it is an attempt to "fix" the sugar profile you have created.

Take a look at this graphic as it helps you to visualise what is going on and what you are doing by varying the mash temp.

[Kegman]

I get the feeling he was confusing times and temperatures, 20 minutes at 90 degrees was what he also said for the hop-back (then 'turned over' for 10 minutes) and adding the bittering hops after 60 minutes should maybe have been 'for the first 60 minutes'. I did question him on both and tell him other brewery's mash at between 60-70 degrees but he was pretty insistent.

The main thing I was interested in were the hops for my Betty Stogs clone and I got a good list of those to play with so it wasn't all bad.... oh and the free beer

[john luc]

I would say that if he entertained you with his spoof then apply the rule of "never let the truth get in the way of telling a good story."

[Belter]

It would explain why they all taste like dishwater and all exactly the same.

[Kegman]

I would say that if he entertained you with his spoof then apply the rule of "never let the truth get in the way of telling a good story."

Not exactly great story though is it? I know I wouldn't want it getting around if I had a brewery.

[Supercooper]

It would explain why they all taste like dishwater and all exactly the same.

Come on Lee,
Whilst I would agree that they all taste similar, dishwater they ain't. Our local stopped selling it, and put on Rebel instead. Now that's gone, ( thank god, it all tastes weird out of that brewery), they're getting Betty stoggs back in. Why? Because people like it! And most importantly, the regulars ( and me) complained.
Perhaps you've not had enough of it to aquire a liking for it. How's about harbour ales? Do they all taste the same? I bet they're similar.
It's the process and equipment that's the same, that's the key to cloning a beer.
Keg man, send me a PM, I can help with the Betty grain bill.