Low Alkalinity Water and High Mash pH

[Matt12398]

Yes I never mess with my sparge water and just go for straight heated tap water. I feel comfortable with how to treat the sparge water but wanted to understand how to get it low enough without adding as much gypsum or CaCl. Acid sounds like the answer but the main question was around the idea of just heating one lot of water of which a portion is used initially for the mash and the rest for sparging.

[mabrungard]

Yes I never mess with my sparge water and just go for straight heated tap water. I feel comfortable with how to treat the sparge water but wanted to understand how to get it low enough without adding as much gypsum or CaCl. Acid sounds like the answer but the main question was around the idea of just heating one lot of water of which a portion is used initially for the mash and the rest for sparging.

Adding minerals does NOT reduce alkalinity in sparging water. Only an acid addition provides that. Adding hardness minerals to water reduces Residual Alkalinity in the mash, but not the sparging water. Acid is our friend (when used correctly).

[Matt12398]

Yes I appreciate that.

I don't want to touch my sparge liqour, just mash liquor. The situation is that all my water is heated together, mash salts added to mash. Unless I go quite high with these the mash is above 5.5. The option is to add acid but as all my water is heated together it would mean treating all of it with acid.

So based on that the only question I had was around that. I understand everything else. Just is it going to cause me issues if I treat all of my liqour with acid when all I really need to do is treat my mash liqour to lower mash pH. I'm not trying to alter the alkalinity levels which are low already, it's just to influence mash pH.

[WallyBrew]

Unless I go quite high with these the mash is above 5.5. The option is to add acid but as all my water is heated together it would mean treating all of it with acid.

Does Bru'n Water have an Exmoor Gold Clone profile?

Do you know if the brewery aims for the same pH as you are aiming for?

I'd stop worrying about the pH and just brew it and see if you like the result

[Belter]

I don't really think it's about recreating exmoor gold. I think it's about nailing water treatment. Hitting the correct mash PH is part of that. It's great to brew a beer and not worry how it turns out and even better if it turns out well but we are having big problems with our (or my) water and are hoping to fix that first and foremost.

[Dave S]

Yes I appreciate that.

I don't want to touch my sparge liqour, just mash liquor. The situation is that all my water is heated together, mash salts added to mash. Unless I go quite high with these the mash is above 5.5. The option is to add acid but as all my water is heated together it would mean treating all of it with acid.

So based on that the only question I had was around that. I understand everything else. Just is it going to cause me issues if I treat all of my liqour with acid when all I really need to do is treat my mash liqour to lower mash pH. I'm not trying to alter the alkalinity levels which are low already, it's just to influence mash pH.

What about if you heat all your water as you suggest, then run your mash water into the tun, then add your acid. I Treat my mash and sparge water separately but I do run the mash water into the MT. let it cool to strike temp, then ad the grains to the water. I know it's suggested that the acid is best added to cold water, but I don't know how much difference it would make.

[mabrungard]

Dave, the reason that its important to add the acid to the water prior to ANY heating is that a water with temporary hardness can have its alkalinity reduced as the heating tends to drive off CO2 from the water. Since the acid additions in Bru'n Water are typically based on the alkalinity of the tap water, you could end up over acidifying the water. If you go to the trouble of measuring the alkalinity of your post-heated water and use that value in the acidification calculation, then its OK to add acid to heated water.

So its not that you want to add acid to cold water. You want to add the acid to water prior to it ever being heated.

[Dave S]

Dave, the reason that its important to add the acid to the water prior to ANY heating is that a water with temporary hardness can have its alkalinity reduced as the heating tends to drive off CO2 from the water. Since the acid additions in Bru'n Water are typically based on the alkalinity of the tap water, you could end up over acidifying the water. If you go to the trouble of measuring the alkalinity of your post-heated water and use that value in the acidification calculation, then its OK to add acid to heated water.

So its not that you want to add acid to cold water. You want to add the acid to water prior to it ever being heated.

I think the real answer is to keep mash water and sparge water separate. Then the problem Matt has will be removed.

[Matt12398]

I always thought that probably that would be the only real answer but hoped there may be a way of doing it without having separate mash and sparge batches. It's only certain recipes that this situation would occur because normally if there is even a hint of a crystal or roasted malt my mash pH sinks through the floor.

Thanks for all the replies.

[Belter]

Not a huge problem for a 90 min mash to get the rest of the water up to temp but a bit of an inconvenience on a 70L brew length

[Dave S]

Before I started to use Bru'n Water I always heated enough water for the whole batch in one lot. I didn't find a hassle at all though separating mash and sparge water once I started using the spread sheet. As belter says, it's no problem heating the sparge water while the mash is on.

[sllimeel]

I didn't find a hassle at all though separating mash and sparge water once I started using the spread sheet. As belter says, it's no problem heating the sparge water while the mash is on.

This what i do also. Treat mash water volume, heat it, add to MT. Treat sparge water, fill HLT, heat whilst mashing for 90mins, works fine!

[mabrungard]

That's the way I do it too. Treat and heat the mashing water, dump into the tun and then treat and heat the sparging water while the mash is in progress. Given the occasional difference in the alkalinity need between the mashing and sparging water, it just makes sense to me to prepare each water separately.