Tomorrow will be the first brewday in quite a while and stocks are low so a big flavoured American PA/IPA is on the cards.
I'm Looking for a 5% beer with good body, not too much malt and LOTS of hoppy goodness. I've got 100g each of three of my favourite hops for 23L all at 15min or less/ dryhopping and a small bittering charge at the beginning. This way I should get good balanced flavour from all three hopefully without the overpowering bitterness from a long boil (at least I hope) that sometimes can mess up hop subtlety (though 300g is - in fairness - not really subtle)
Recipe:
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048
Final Gravity (FG): 1.012 - 1014
Alcohol (ABV): 4.7 % (5% with priming sugar)
Colour (SRM): 5.8 (EBC): 11.4
Bitterness (IBU): 41.4 (Average)
85.71% Maris Otter Malt (4.2 kg)
5.1% Munich I (250g)
5.1% Vienna (250g)
4.08% Torrified Wheat (200g)
0.2 g/L Apollo (19.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.9 g/L Ahtanum (5.2% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
0.9 g/L Citra (14.8% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
0.9 g/L Experimental 366 (15.7% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
1.7 g/L Ahtanum (5.2% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma)
1.7 g/L Citra (14.8% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma)
1.7 g/L Experimental 366 (15.7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma)
1.7 g/L Ahtanum (5.2% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop)
1.7 g/L Citra (14.8% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop)
1.7 g/L Experimental 366 (15.7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop)
Water profile
Calcium: 150 ppm Sulfate: 220 ppm Chloride: 60 ppm Magnesium: 5 ppm
predicted mash pH 5.3 (I hit this almost every time)
Single step Infusion at 69°C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 60 Minutes
Fermented at 20°C with Safale US-05
Any comments/ suggestions welcome as usual
Cheers !
ACE IPA
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Matt12398
Re: ACE IPA
I sampled my Ahtanum brew at the weekend thinking it would be really punchy but it was quite a mild flavour. How have you found it?
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faeyd
Re: ACE IPA
Hey Killer - I really like the look of that - it's my fave style and I am a hop addict.... I have never pushed the hops as hard as you have there so let us know how this one goes 
Jeff
Jeff
Re: ACE IPA
@ Matt
I did a "pimp my beer" day at a local beer cellar. I took a bunch of heineken 250mL bottles and added a hop tea/ dry hop of single hopped Citra, Amarillo and Ahtanum and then one with a blend of Ahtanum and Citra. I recapped them and left them for 3 days. Everyones favourite was the Ahtanum. I really liked it - but I aggressively hopped them. I got a strong taste of Lime, citrus etc from them. A quite distinct hop... and I think they blend very well. I haven't tried them in a single hop beer myself (not sure if the heineken bottle counts !). Any commercial beer I've ever tasted which claimed to have them I've also enjoyed a lot...
WIll do Jeff - and there is worse than me - I've seen people put 600g and more in 23L on this site.
I didn't get to brew this today - small family emergency came up - next time... though I did find 100g Mosaic while preparing this morning that I forgot I had.
I did a "pimp my beer" day at a local beer cellar. I took a bunch of heineken 250mL bottles and added a hop tea/ dry hop of single hopped Citra, Amarillo and Ahtanum and then one with a blend of Ahtanum and Citra. I recapped them and left them for 3 days. Everyones favourite was the Ahtanum. I really liked it - but I aggressively hopped them. I got a strong taste of Lime, citrus etc from them. A quite distinct hop... and I think they blend very well. I haven't tried them in a single hop beer myself (not sure if the heineken bottle counts !). Any commercial beer I've ever tasted which claimed to have them I've also enjoyed a lot...
WIll do Jeff - and there is worse than me - I've seen people put 600g and more in 23L on this site.
I didn't get to brew this today - small family emergency came up - next time... though I did find 100g Mosaic while preparing this morning that I forgot I had.
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scuppeteer
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Re: ACE IPA
I would be inclined to FWH the Apollo, its a great hop but can be a bit harsh if just used at a 60min addition. Looks like a fine recipe.
Dave Berry
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
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YeastWhisperer
Re: ACE IPA
That recipe is definitely an American Pale Ale, not an American IPA. I am a BJCP judge. Entering a "hoppy" American Pale Ale as an American IPA is a very common problem at competitions (one that causes an otherwise very good beer to lose significant points for being out of style). American Pale Ale and American IPA have gravity ranges in addition to bitterness levels. The low end of the gravity range for American IPA is 1.056; however, most examples of the style have gravities that are firmly in the mid to upper sixties. The recipe shown above is at the bottom of the gravity range for American Pale Ale.
Here are the BJCP style guidlines for category 10A American Pale Ale and category 14B American IPA:
10A. American Pale Ale
Aroma: Usually moderate to strong hop aroma from dry hopping or late kettle additions of American hop varieties. A citrusy hop character is very common, but not required. Low to moderate maltiness supports the hop presentation, and may optionally show small amounts of specialty malt character (bready, toasty, biscuity). Fruity esters vary from moderate to none. No diacetyl. Dry hopping (if used) may add grassy notes, although this character should not be excessive.
Appearance: Pale golden to deep amber. Moderately large white to off-white head with good retention. Generally quite clear, although dry-hopped versions may be slightly hazy.
Flavor: Usually a moderate to high hop flavor, often showing a citrusy American hop character (although other hop varieties may be used). Low to moderately high clean malt character supports the hop presentation, and may optionally show small amounts of specialty malt character (bready, toasty, biscuity). The balance is typically towards the late hops and bitterness, but the malt presence can be substantial. Caramel flavors are usually restrained or absent. Fruity esters can be moderate to none. Moderate to high hop bitterness with a medium to dry finish. Hop flavor and bitterness often lingers into the finish. No diacetyl. Dry hopping (if used) may add grassy notes, although this character should not be excessive.
Mouthfeel: Medium-light to medium body. Carbonation moderate to high. Overall smooth finish without astringency often associated with high hopping rates.
Overall Impression: Refreshing and hoppy, yet with sufficient supporting malt.
Comments: There is some overlap in color between American pale ale and American amber ale. The American pale ale will generally be cleaner, have a less caramelly malt profile, less body, and often more finishing hops.
History: An American adaptation of English pale ale, reflecting indigenous ingredients (hops, malt, yeast, and water). Often lighter in color, cleaner in fermentation by-products, and having less caramel flavors than English counterparts.
Ingredients: Pale ale malt, typically American two-row. American hops, often but not always ones with a citrusy character. American ale yeast. Water can vary in sulfate content, but carbonate content should be relatively low. Specialty grains may add character and complexity, but generally make up a relatively small portion of the grist. Grains that add malt flavor and richness, light sweetness, and toasty or bready notes are often used (along with late hops) to differentiate brands.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.045 – 1.060
IBUs: 30 – 45+ FG: 1.010 – 1.015
SRM: 5 – 14 ABV: 4.5 – 6.2%
Commercial Examples: Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, Stone Pale Ale, Great Lakes Burning River Pale Ale, Bear Republic XP Pale Ale, Anderson Valley Poleeko Gold Pale Ale, Deschutes Mirror Pond, Full Sail Pale Ale, Three Floyds X-Tra Pale Ale, Firestone Pale Ale, Left Hand Brewing Jackman’s Pale Ale
Back to top
14B. American IPA
Aroma: A prominent to intense hop aroma with a citrusy, floral, perfume-like, resinous, piney, and/or fruity character derived from American hops. Many versions are dry hopped and can have an additional grassy aroma, although this is not required. Some clean malty sweetness may be found in the background, but should be at a lower level than in English examples. Fruitiness, either from esters or hops, may also be detected in some versions, although a neutral fermentation character is also acceptable. Some alcohol may be noted.
Appearance: Color ranges from medium gold to medium reddish copper; some versions can have an orange-ish tint. Should be clear, although unfiltered dry-hopped versions may be a bit hazy. Good head stand with white to off-white color should persist.
Flavor: Hop flavor is medium to high, and should reflect an American hop character with citrusy, floral, resinous, piney or fruity aspects. Medium-high to very high hop bitterness, although the malt backbone will support the strong hop character and provide the best balance. Malt flavor should be low to medium, and is generally clean and malty sweet although some caramel or toasty flavors are acceptable at low levels. No diacetyl. Low fruitiness is acceptable but not required. The bitterness may linger into the aftertaste but should not be harsh. Medium-dry to dry finish. Some clean alcohol flavor can be noted in stronger versions. Oak is inappropriate in this style. May be slightly sulfury, but most examples do not exhibit this character.
Mouthfeel: Smooth, medium-light to medium-bodied mouthfeel without hop-derived astringency, although moderate to medium-high carbonation can combine to render an overall dry sensation in the presence of malt sweetness. Some smooth alcohol warming can and should be sensed in stronger (but not all) versions. Body is generally less than in English counterparts.
Overall Impression: A decidedly hoppy and bitter, moderately strong American pale ale.
History: An American version of the historical English style, brewed using American ingredients and attitude.
Ingredients: Pale ale malt (well-modified and suitable for single-temperature infusion mashing); American hops; American yeast that can give a clean or slightly fruity profile. Generally all-malt, but mashed at lower temperatures for high attenuation. Water character varies from soft to moderately sulfate. Versions with a noticeable Rye character (“RyePA”) should be entered in the Specialty category.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.056 – 1.075
IBUs: 40 – 70 FG: 1.010 – 1.018
SRM: 6 – 15 ABV: 5.5 – 7.5%
Commercial Examples: Bell’s Two-Hearted Ale, AleSmith IPA, Russian River Blind Pig IPA, Stone IPA, Three Floyds Alpha King, Great Divide Titan IPA, Bear Republic Racer 5 IPA, Victory Hop Devil, Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale, Anderson Valley Hop Ottin’, Dogfish Head 60 Minute IPA, Founder’s Centennial IPA, Anchor Liberty Ale, Harpoon IPA, Avery IPA
By the way, you are going to have to boost the O.G. to 1.050 in order to hit 5% with an F.G. of 1.012 (or hope that the beer ferments down to 1.010). One needs to achieve 38 gravity points of apparent attenuation in order to achieve an ABV of 5%.
Here are the BJCP style guidlines for category 10A American Pale Ale and category 14B American IPA:
10A. American Pale Ale
Aroma: Usually moderate to strong hop aroma from dry hopping or late kettle additions of American hop varieties. A citrusy hop character is very common, but not required. Low to moderate maltiness supports the hop presentation, and may optionally show small amounts of specialty malt character (bready, toasty, biscuity). Fruity esters vary from moderate to none. No diacetyl. Dry hopping (if used) may add grassy notes, although this character should not be excessive.
Appearance: Pale golden to deep amber. Moderately large white to off-white head with good retention. Generally quite clear, although dry-hopped versions may be slightly hazy.
Flavor: Usually a moderate to high hop flavor, often showing a citrusy American hop character (although other hop varieties may be used). Low to moderately high clean malt character supports the hop presentation, and may optionally show small amounts of specialty malt character (bready, toasty, biscuity). The balance is typically towards the late hops and bitterness, but the malt presence can be substantial. Caramel flavors are usually restrained or absent. Fruity esters can be moderate to none. Moderate to high hop bitterness with a medium to dry finish. Hop flavor and bitterness often lingers into the finish. No diacetyl. Dry hopping (if used) may add grassy notes, although this character should not be excessive.
Mouthfeel: Medium-light to medium body. Carbonation moderate to high. Overall smooth finish without astringency often associated with high hopping rates.
Overall Impression: Refreshing and hoppy, yet with sufficient supporting malt.
Comments: There is some overlap in color between American pale ale and American amber ale. The American pale ale will generally be cleaner, have a less caramelly malt profile, less body, and often more finishing hops.
History: An American adaptation of English pale ale, reflecting indigenous ingredients (hops, malt, yeast, and water). Often lighter in color, cleaner in fermentation by-products, and having less caramel flavors than English counterparts.
Ingredients: Pale ale malt, typically American two-row. American hops, often but not always ones with a citrusy character. American ale yeast. Water can vary in sulfate content, but carbonate content should be relatively low. Specialty grains may add character and complexity, but generally make up a relatively small portion of the grist. Grains that add malt flavor and richness, light sweetness, and toasty or bready notes are often used (along with late hops) to differentiate brands.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.045 – 1.060
IBUs: 30 – 45+ FG: 1.010 – 1.015
SRM: 5 – 14 ABV: 4.5 – 6.2%
Commercial Examples: Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, Stone Pale Ale, Great Lakes Burning River Pale Ale, Bear Republic XP Pale Ale, Anderson Valley Poleeko Gold Pale Ale, Deschutes Mirror Pond, Full Sail Pale Ale, Three Floyds X-Tra Pale Ale, Firestone Pale Ale, Left Hand Brewing Jackman’s Pale Ale
Back to top
14B. American IPA
Aroma: A prominent to intense hop aroma with a citrusy, floral, perfume-like, resinous, piney, and/or fruity character derived from American hops. Many versions are dry hopped and can have an additional grassy aroma, although this is not required. Some clean malty sweetness may be found in the background, but should be at a lower level than in English examples. Fruitiness, either from esters or hops, may also be detected in some versions, although a neutral fermentation character is also acceptable. Some alcohol may be noted.
Appearance: Color ranges from medium gold to medium reddish copper; some versions can have an orange-ish tint. Should be clear, although unfiltered dry-hopped versions may be a bit hazy. Good head stand with white to off-white color should persist.
Flavor: Hop flavor is medium to high, and should reflect an American hop character with citrusy, floral, resinous, piney or fruity aspects. Medium-high to very high hop bitterness, although the malt backbone will support the strong hop character and provide the best balance. Malt flavor should be low to medium, and is generally clean and malty sweet although some caramel or toasty flavors are acceptable at low levels. No diacetyl. Low fruitiness is acceptable but not required. The bitterness may linger into the aftertaste but should not be harsh. Medium-dry to dry finish. Some clean alcohol flavor can be noted in stronger versions. Oak is inappropriate in this style. May be slightly sulfury, but most examples do not exhibit this character.
Mouthfeel: Smooth, medium-light to medium-bodied mouthfeel without hop-derived astringency, although moderate to medium-high carbonation can combine to render an overall dry sensation in the presence of malt sweetness. Some smooth alcohol warming can and should be sensed in stronger (but not all) versions. Body is generally less than in English counterparts.
Overall Impression: A decidedly hoppy and bitter, moderately strong American pale ale.
History: An American version of the historical English style, brewed using American ingredients and attitude.
Ingredients: Pale ale malt (well-modified and suitable for single-temperature infusion mashing); American hops; American yeast that can give a clean or slightly fruity profile. Generally all-malt, but mashed at lower temperatures for high attenuation. Water character varies from soft to moderately sulfate. Versions with a noticeable Rye character (“RyePA”) should be entered in the Specialty category.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.056 – 1.075
IBUs: 40 – 70 FG: 1.010 – 1.018
SRM: 6 – 15 ABV: 5.5 – 7.5%
Commercial Examples: Bell’s Two-Hearted Ale, AleSmith IPA, Russian River Blind Pig IPA, Stone IPA, Three Floyds Alpha King, Great Divide Titan IPA, Bear Republic Racer 5 IPA, Victory Hop Devil, Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale, Anderson Valley Hop Ottin’, Dogfish Head 60 Minute IPA, Founder’s Centennial IPA, Anchor Liberty Ale, Harpoon IPA, Avery IPA
By the way, you are going to have to boost the O.G. to 1.050 in order to hit 5% with an F.G. of 1.012 (or hope that the beer ferments down to 1.010). One needs to achieve 38 gravity points of apparent attenuation in order to achieve an ABV of 5%.
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scuppeteer
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Re: ACE IPA
Take yourself outside and have a word, Killer only asked for advice not a bloody lecture on the finer points of competition beer! Its his beer and can call it whatever he likes.
Dave Berry
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
Re: ACE IPA
scuppeteer wrote:I would be inclined to FWH the Apollo, its a great hop but can be a bit harsh if just used at a 60min addition. Looks like a fine recipe.
I'll try that - I am BIABing this so I might throw them in when I pull the bag.
@ Yeastwhisperer - I do have a copy of the BJCP guidelines but ACE IPA sounds much better than ACE PA don't you think ?
To be frank I have mixed feelings about the guidelines, which while useful, and a reasonable framework within which to place beer categories, I find the pedantry associated with beer styling to be galling at times. Strict adherence to a set of numbers seems also a little restrictive when it comes to beer evolution and the fun that home brewers have by throwing in random herbs or hops (not normal to the style). And lets be honest - giving an IBU range to a homebrewer is a little bit of a joke considering the range of systems, boil strength, storage conditions and hops that people use - not everyone has access to a spectrophotometer/ HPLC instrument to determine their IBU (I do incidentally) or to calibrate their bitterness.
The reality is that while many beers are placed into categories, I suspect these beers have gone through many iterations over the past few centuries.... just look at the recent IPA book by Mitch Steele - how does one define which period/ record/ Brewer/ Author defines the style ? Do all previous historical examples fit in the current BJCP range ?
I appreciate your input here and have definitely enjoyed some of your experience and insight on yeast and hops in other forums, but I find the BJCP system a little bit too rigid for my (current) brewing
Happy brewing
Incidentally - the addition of the priming sugar should bring this beer to approx 5 %
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Deebee
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Re: ACE IPA
Although Yeastwhispers post could be seen as a lecture i would think it was meant as a guide.
to be honest i make what i make, the way i like it. He he i would imagine that most of the stuff i make is wayout of the guidelines, and for me thats ok. I do not intend to enter competitions. I make beer to give away 8 note give away and not sell) and also drink myself.
As long as i like it and it gives me a nice whoozy feeling after a few points.. SUCCESS!
may i suggest that we all take a bit of a breath and keep the atmosphere on the forum as it always has been , fun and light hearted. I have left other ( non brew related ) forums due to petty arguments etc between members and well. this place just rocks too much for that!
SKÅL
to be honest i make what i make, the way i like it. He he i would imagine that most of the stuff i make is wayout of the guidelines, and for me thats ok. I do not intend to enter competitions. I make beer to give away 8 note give away and not sell) and also drink myself.
As long as i like it and it gives me a nice whoozy feeling after a few points.. SUCCESS!
may i suggest that we all take a bit of a breath and keep the atmosphere on the forum as it always has been , fun and light hearted. I have left other ( non brew related ) forums due to petty arguments etc between members and well. this place just rocks too much for that!
SKÅL Dave
Running for Childrens cancer in the Windsor Half marathon.
Please consider helping a good cause:)
Running for Childrens cancer in the Windsor Half marathon.
Please consider helping a good cause:)
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Fido97
Re: ACE IPA
Yes - steady on Scuppeteer - the guy was only trying to help. Personally even after reading Yeastwhisperers post I think there is considerable margin for the 2 styles to cross over as at the end of the day they are both pale ales with lots of what many Brits would call new world hops. On the other hand I completely understand the fact that there are separate categories in US beer competitions so there is a need for parameters to be set.
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scuppeteer
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Re: ACE IPA
My apologies Yeast whisperer. I do appreciate you were only giving stated US guidelines for beer style and my response may have been a bit OTT. As we are all homebrewers we may feel that our beers are a certain style even if they are not quite correct to the trained eye/tongue. 
I have to say I do also get a bit annoyed about beers being termed IPA's. One of our larger breweries, Green King, have the nerve to call their core beer an IPA when at 3.6% its more like dishwater, completely lacking in strength and devoid of any hop flavour!
I have to say I do also get a bit annoyed about beers being termed IPA's. One of our larger breweries, Green King, have the nerve to call their core beer an IPA when at 3.6% its more like dishwater, completely lacking in strength and devoid of any hop flavour!
Dave Berry
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
Can't be arsed to keep changing this bit, so, drinking some beer and wanting to brew many more!
Sir, you are drunk! Yes madam, and you are ugly, but in the morning I shall be sober! - WSC
Re: ACE IPA
Looks Ace Killer! Have you tried experimental 366 in a single hop brew. What are they like. got a bag in the freezer and not sure how to go?
Stay Home - Make Beer - Drink Beer
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Deebee
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Re: ACE IPA
I have a trial brew with ex 366 planned.... just wonder when inwill get to brew it.CestrIan wrote:Looks Ace Killer! Have you tried experimental 366 in a single hop brew. What are they like. got a bag in the freezer and not sure how to go?
Dave
Running for Childrens cancer in the Windsor Half marathon.
Please consider helping a good cause:)
Running for Childrens cancer in the Windsor Half marathon.
Please consider helping a good cause:)
Re: ACE IPA
I have tasted the Kernels Exp 366 IPA - fantastic beer - It's also part of Brewdogs IPA is dead for this year. Again it's a hop that is fairly distinct to say Citra or centennial- I think it's a bit more subtle. This is the first time I've brewed with it. I'm keeping all the hops late to not overpower it. There is another thread on here by Barry44 (I think) who has just bottled up a batch - NobbyIPA too - he brewed a beer like in this thread with lots of american hops.
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crimsongarlic
- Steady Drinker
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:58 pm
Re: ACE IPA
I've done a single hop brew with them. While it's nice I'd be careful about over-bittering with them.CestrIan wrote:Looks Ace Killer! Have you tried experimental 366 in a single hop brew. What are they like. got a bag in the freezer and not sure how to go?
I did a 16 1.047SG litre brew with 15g first wort addition, 10g at 10 mins and 40g at flameout (this may have been an 80deg steep - not sure!) and 35g dry hop.
BeerSmith gave me an IBU of around 40 from memory but since they have updated the iPhone app this has been recalculated to 66IBU!
It's pretty nice cold but as it warms there's a definite liquorice taste that comes through. I'll be re-brewing it but maybe with a different bittering hop or move some of the steeping hops to the dry hop.