ACE IPA

[Cpt.Frederickson]

Looks like a good brew killer. Personally I like Ahtanum as a dry hop, did an amber with 100g Apollo and 100g amarillo in the boil recently and 100g Ahtanum dry hop. Bloody lovely.
To wade into the debate about guidelines, I find it more important in my brews to brew something I like rather than something to fit the style guidelines for beer judges. If I was brewing for competitions I'd have a different approach maybe, but I brew for me primarily
Best of luck with it mate
El Capitan

[Hanglow]

My apologies Yeast whisperer. I do appreciate you were only giving stated US guidelines for beer style and my response may have been a bit OTT. As we are all homebrewers we may feel that our beers are a certain style even if they are not quite correct to the trained eye/tongue.

I have to say I do also get a bit annoyed about beers being termed IPA's. One of our larger breweries, Green King, have the nerve to call their core beer an IPA when at 3.6% its more like dishwater, completely lacking in strength and devoid of any hop flavour!

yes are a lot of breweries who tag IPA onto something that would be better called just a pale ale in todays market

Although to be fair to greene king, a number of breweries IPAs evolved into what we'd call bitters now (which what GK IPA is I suppose albeit a bad one) and that particular beer has a hundred year history, so I think they are well within their rights to call it that

[killer]

Looks like a good brew killer. Personally I like Ahtanum as a dry hop, did an amber with 100g Apollo and 100g amarillo in the boil recently and 100g Ahtanum dry hop. Bloody lovely.
To wade into the debate about guidelines, I find it more important in my brews to brew something I like rather than something to fit the style guidelines for beer judges. If I was brewing for competitions I'd have a different approach maybe, but I brew for me primarily
Best of luck with it mate
El Capitan

Cheers Cap'n - 3 nice hops there - I find 300g american in 25L is spot on - expensive way to brew but gives great beers.


I brewed this beer today.

Couple of changes to the recipe - I didn't have enough Marris Otter and no Torrified wheat !
So I ended with 3.6 kg MO, 800g Vienna and 250g Munich.
Mashed at 68°. - hit mash pH target of 5.3 Bloody boiler cut out at 86°C so had to stop, get the wort (and FWH hops - all 5g of apollo) out, clean the element and get going again.
Boiled for one hour. 20gms each Exp366, Citra and Ahtanum for 15min, same again at 0.5min and same again at 70°C for 30 min steep.
The smell of the mix of the three hops in the tupperware was fantastic - I have high hopes for this beer.
Pitched a rehydrated S05 at 20°.

[CestrIan]

Looks Ace Killer! Have you tried experimental 366 in a single hop brew. What are they like. got a bag in the freezer and not sure how to go?

I've done a single hop brew with them. While it's nice I'd be careful about over-bittering with them.

I did a 16 1.047SG litre brew with 15g first wort addition, 10g at 10 mins and 40g at flameout (this may have been an 80deg steep - not sure!) and 35g dry hop.

BeerSmith gave me an IBU of around 40 from memory but since they have updated the iPhone app this has been recalculated to 66IBU!

It's pretty nice cold but as it warms there's a definite liquorice taste that comes through. I'll be re-brewing it but maybe with a different bittering hop or move some of the steeping hops to the dry hop.

Liquorice!! What was your grain bill! Do you think the liquorice comes from the hops? That doesn't seem like a lot of hops to be too bitter. What was the AA%?

[DeGarre]

...

I have to say I do also get a bit annoyed about beers being termed IPA's. One of our larger breweries, Green King, have the nerve to call their core beer an IPA when at 3.6% its more like dishwater, completely lacking in strength and devoid of any hop flavour!

And still GK has brewed that beer under IPA label for about 100 years...

Beer styles evolve over time. Who's to say which time point is when a beer style should be locked in to be authentic? IPAs in 1850, or 1910, or whenever Lagunitas IPA was invented?

[YeastWhisperer]

...
Beer styles evolve over time. Who's to say which time point is when a beer style should be locked in to be authentic? IPAs in 1850, or 1910, or whenever Lagunitas IPA was invented?

Anchor Liberty Ale was the first American IPA as well as the first American beer to showcase cascade. One could say that Ballantine IPA is the oldest American IPA, but it was closer to traditional British IPA in style.

With that said, IPA has become a marketing term in the U.S. Any hoppy beer style that appeals to hipsters receives the IPA suffix. The poorest name choice of all is Black India Pale Ale, which is a contradiction of terms. This beer style has been recognized as "American Black Ale" in the 2014 BJCP Style Guidelines. Previously, Black IPAs had to be entered as specialty beers.

[killer]

...
Beer styles evolve over time. Who's to say which time point is when a beer style should be locked in to be authentic? IPAs in 1850, or 1910, or whenever Lagunitas IPA was invented?

Anchor Liberty Ale was the first American IPA as well as the first American beer to showcase cascade. One could say that Ballantine IPA is the oldest American IPA, but it was closer to traditional British IPA in style.

Is Cascade still as big as it ever was in the states ? It was the hop that got me into American beers. Now however, I find it pales in comparison to some of the newer crop - Citra, Centennial et. al. It tastes a bit one dimensional relative to these for me.

[YeastWhisperer]

Cascade is still used heavily in amateur and craft brewing. Centennial is not a new hop. It has been in heavy use since the nineties. Citra, well, let's leave that one alone. I hold nothing but contempt for proprietary hop cultivars, especially when proprietary hop breeders refuse to release parentage. The brewing world would be much poorer if Ray Neve and Al Haunold had decided to take this approach with their hop research. Ray Neve is responsible for developing Wye Challenger, Wye Northdown, Wye Saxon, Wye Target, and Wye Yeoman. He also started the dwarf hop research program that eventually led to the development of Prima Donna. The team that Al Haunold lead is responsible for developing Crystal, Liberty, Mt. Hood, Nugget, Santiam, Sterling, Ulta, Willamette, and several other hop cultivars. While Al did not breed Cascade, he oversaw its introduction.

Here's an interesting article about how unreleased USDA hop germplasm found its way into private corporate hands (we refer to this practice as privatizing profit while socializing risk in the U.S.): http://inhoppursuit.blogspot.com/2010/0 ... f-ctz.html

[killer]

Here's an interesting article about how unreleased USDA hop germplasm found its way into private corporate hands (we refer to this practice as privatizing profit while socializing risk in the U.S.): http://inhoppursuit.blogspot.com/2010/0 ... f-ctz.html

Interesting article - thank you for the link. I'll definitely have a good look at that blog.

This beer finished at 1014 and I transferred it to secondary today with the dry hop. I'm very happy with the taste. It is malty - but in a subtle not overpowering way. It is also reasonably bitter but that balances very well with the maltiness. What I really like is that the flavour lingered for quite some time on my tongue after I had finished the hydrometer sample. The predominant hop flavour is the exp 366 but that might well change over time especially with the dry hop addition.

[killer]

So this beer ended up 2 weeks in primary and 2 weeks in a pressure barrel with the dry hops. It was a bit too bitter initially and with a little grassiness. Now that it's 5 weeks in the bottle it's much more well balanced - nice bitterness, lots of mouthfeel (finishing at 1013) and a shedload of fruity hoppiness - grapefruit, lime, peach, mango - a bitter fruit salad !

I can still not get over how much the flavour from these types of superhoppy beers changes as the weeks go on.... The Exp 366/ Apollo dominated completely initally (1 - 3 weeks) and now it's much more well rounded.