Water profile for Bohemian Pilsner

[spook100]

I'm brewing a Bohemian pilsner this weekend. I have some Czech friends coming over to visit in a couple of months and want to get it just right so am going to have my first bash and water treatment. I have checked out the Tesco Ashbeck bottled water profile and it is pretty close to the Pilsen water profile in Beersmith

Ashbeck profile
Ca 10
Mg 2.5
Na 9
SO4 10
Cl 12
HCO3 25

Pilsen Profile
Ca 7
Mg 2
Na 2
SO4 5
Cl 9
HCO3 15

However, I have read in several different places that that you should shoot for at least 50ppm Calcium because it is necessary for health yeast growth. So my question is: do I need to treat the water further to up the Ca (do the Czech brewers treat their water?) and, if so, what do I add. Using the Beersmith water profile tool would suggest 3g of chalk (CaCO3) would result in the following profile:
Ca 62
Mg 2.5
Na 9
SO4 10
Cl 12
HCO3 103
Would this profile be suitable for a genuine Czech Pilsner?

[mabrungard]

Yeast most definitely don't require calcium in the water to ferment well. Malt supplies all the calcium the yeast need for their metabolism. However, there are reasons to add calcium salts to water. For ales, having more than 50 ppm calcium is helpful for getting the beer to clarify reasonably quickly. For lagers, the need for calcium is much lower.

I prefer to add calcium salts only to the mashing water such that the calcium content is brought above 40 ppm. That helps remove oxalate from the wort via precipitation. I then sparge the mash with unmineralized water to bring the overall concentrations down in the kettle.

You definitely don't want to use chalk...especially in a pils. You'll actually need some acid in the mash in order to bring the mash pH down to a desirable level (~5.4). I suggest small additions of calcium chloride and gypsum to the mash to bring the calcium content up around 40 ppm, then use the Ashbeck water without added salts for sparging.

[spook100]

Thanks for the tips, Martin. Coincidentally, I came across one of your posts on another forum and had already decided to ditch the chalk in favour of gypsum and calcium chloride based on that. Just to clarify on your point about only treating the mash water - do you add enough just to bring the mash water up to 40ppm calcium or to bring the entire volume of collected wort up to 40ppm?

[HTH1975]

I’ve wandered about brewing with such low-calcium liquor and how this would translate to the finished beer. I brewed a Kölsch with Ashbeck about three weeks ago and added salts to get around 95ppm calcium - I just wanted to use a lowish amount and see how the beer turned out before trying to brew with barely any minerals at all.

It’s been lagering for almost a week now, so in a month it will be bottled and ready to try. Will report back on how it worked out.

[wellyftw]

How did it turn out?

[MTW]

I see this is an old thread, but for anyone interested, I used 100% Ashbeck for a Pilsner a while back and I got a very clean result (yeast was 34/70). It was 3.5% acid malt. 5ml AMS, 4g calcium chloride and 2g gypsum, but I was shooting for a mash pH of 5.2. All salts went in my whole starting volume of 35L for a 19L batch in the FV.

Interesting to hear Martin's comments.

[johnnyboy1965]

JMHO...you cannot replicate a water profile, as a HB`er its impossible. Im Chef not a Chemist. Brew the beers that suit your tap water.
Why would you want to throw so many chemicals at your wort, that you dont really understand what they do?
I live in Solihull, West Mids our water is supplied by Severn Trent, it has a Ph of 8.4, which is ideal for Stouts/Porters, its just a shame that I prefer bitters/IPA`s, that I cannot brew with my water.
Now if I had to brew a IPA/bitter, I would have to throw/guess a bucket full of chemicals at my brew, without actually knowing what they do

[gaunt_paul]

Why would you want to throw so many chemicals at your wort, that you dont really understand what they do?

IMO It's worth trying to suss out what these minerals do, as it has a big impact on the final product. If you can find a guide that speaks your language (this was the biggest obstacle for me, i'm no chemist either) it's not such a nightmare. If the rest of your process is good, water chemistry is well worth looking into


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[HTH1975]

How did it turn out?

If you mean my Kölsch, then it turned out great. Very happy with the results. It’s long gone now mind, especially with that hot summer we had.

[shepp]

[quote=johnnyboy1965 post_id=840023 time=1545155139 user_id=18009]
JMHO...you cannot replicate a water profile, as a HB`er its impossible. Im Chef not a Chemist. Brew the beers that suit your tap water.
Why would you want to throw so many chemicals at your wort, that you dont really understand what they do?
I live in Solihull, West Mids our water is supplied by Severn Trent, it has a Ph of 8.4, which is ideal for Stouts/Porters, its just a shame that I prefer bitters/IPA`s, that I cannot brew with my water.
Now if I had to brew a IPA/bitter, I would have to throw/guess a bucket full of chemicals at my brew, without actually knowing what they do
[/quote]

If people approached every obstactle in life with a similar outlook, we would all be living in caves, throwing rocks at animals.
Brewers all over the country learn about water and what is needed to make various styles of beer, that's why Fullers make everything from porters to golden ales and there water is hard like mine.
Chemicals make up everthing around us, including us, it's nothing to be scared of.

[Jocky]

JMHO...you cannot replicate a water profile, as a HB`er its impossible. Im Chef not a Chemist. Brew the beers that suit your tap water.
Why would you want to throw so many chemicals at your wort, that you dont really understand what they do?
I live in Solihull, West Mids our water is supplied by Severn Trent, it has a Ph of 8.4, which is ideal for Stouts/Porters, its just a shame that I prefer bitters/IPA`s, that I cannot brew with my water.
Now if I had to brew a IPA/bitter, I would have to throw/guess a bucket full of chemicals at my brew, without actually knowing what they do

I agree that you should just chuck anything into your beer without knowing what it will do, but I don't agree with the idea that you're adding a 'bucket of chemicals'.

As a Chef, do you not add sodium chloride to food?? Chloride/Sulphate balance adjustment is to beer what seasoning is to food. Also the range of acids you will unwittingly use for cooking processes or flavour reasons is surprising (lemon juice = citric acid, vinegar = acetic acid, the tang in yoghurt or cheese = lactic acid).

Additionally pH is not a determinant of the suitability of water for brewing. For that you need a proper water report, or at least to get an alkalinity test kit and know what your water alkalinity is. UK municipal drinking water is rarely unusable for brewing if time is taken to understand and treat it correctly, and can be turned to almost any style.