newbie help please

[sparkybrew]

Morning All,

36 hour update:

Still no bubbles in the airlock, i removed the clingfilm last night having read your post Orlando thankyou.

I can still see there is a head on the brew so crossing my fingers.

[Nitro Jim]

Morning All,

36 hour update:

Still no bubbles in the airlock, i removed the clingfilm last night having read your post Orlando thankyou.

I can still see there is a head on the brew so crossing my fingers.

Do not worry about the lack of activity in the airlock. If there is gas being produced it will take the course of least resistance so is probably escaping elsewhere. I gave up using an airlock, my fermenting buckets have a small hole in the lid which I insert a golf tee into - it works for me.

[sparkybrew]

Good evening everyone,

Thankyou for your support so far.

Well, the brew is now 10 days old in the FV, the plan is to bottle in the morning. However, removed the airlock tonight briefly for a peek and was greeted by the same vinegar type smell so i'm a little concerned at the moment.

I can see there is white bubbles on the top and trub in the bottom of the FV. I'll take some photos tomorrow.

Could it be I'm smelling a mixture of co2 and yeast?

Everything was thoroughly sanitised, even the tin opener and the scissors.

The airlock never bubbled during fermentation but there was a Krausen on day2. The only other factor was a slight temperature fluctuation between 18degC and 21.5degC during fermentation.

Fingers crossed, will let you know how things are in the morning.

[guypettigrew]

This isn't sounding too good, is it? Hope today's update is more positive.

Guy

[sparkybrew]

Evening everyone or should I say morning,

Day didn't go as planned so started bottling very late. Unfortunately the brew had that same vinegar smell and tasted very sour. The OG was 1043 and finished at 1007.

I decided to bottle it anyway, for practice if nothing else to get an idea of how much time is involved.

I'm a little dejected at the mo but will bouce back for the next brew. I have ordered some chemsan and am in the process of coverting a fridge to a FV chamber with an STC1000.

I'm going to attach a couple of photos of the brew and the first bottle.

There is a positive note to the day..... My sloe gin and sloe vodka are looking amazing

Not sure how to add a photo, will have another look tonight

[orlando]

It's almost certainly a sanitation issue. Despite you bleaching your equipment something must have been missed or not resanitised before use. Think back to everything you did. Was there any equipment used that had not been bleached? Did you take a sample to test the OG and use anything that hadn't been sanitised, even after bleaching, before you did. Did you pour the sample back into the wort, not worth the risk for 100ml of Beer? Bleaching is the start of eliminating bacteria but it constantly circulates the atmosphere so will settle again so spray evrything coming into contact with the wort immediately before it does so. Make sure you give the sanitiser the time it needs to be effective. It may be making you dejected but it is a salutary lesson that once learned and dialled in to your process will become second nature. Don't give up.

[wanus]

Certainly don`t give up.Even experienced brewers have off days and drainers a plenty.
Good luck sparkybrew.

[sparkybrew]

Thanks everyone,

I will crack this, everything was sanitised as follows:

the FV was filled with warm water and cleaned with OXI, the lid, airlock, bung, spoon and everything was put inside and left to soak. then tipped away, rinsed with the shower and then soaked with a little bleach for about 30mins. tipped away, rinsed. the thermometer, tin opener and scissors were cleaned and kept in boiling water.

This time I just used tap water, used the kettle to boil a litre and a half, poured that in the FV, added the wort and sugar, stirred and added the cold water. took the sample for the OG with a sanitised turkey baster which went down the sink.

the only thing I can think of is the thermometer is a digital food thermometer which i cannot fully submerse. inbetween readings it was kept in the boiled water as deep as possible.

Chemsan arrived today so next time will also have a spray to hand.

Cleaned the FV with OXI last night but it still smells a bit from the brew so will give that a dose of bleach soon (4ml/litre).

Meantime heres the photos from last night (if I've worked out how to post them lol).

Thankyou all for your support

[Trefoyl]

Make sure you take apart the tap on the fermenter if there is one.
Do you have a ball lock on your boiler? If so, take that apart and boil next time you brew.
It’s odd that you have infections like this when just starting out though if the equipment is new. Could it be the yeast packets aren’t good?

[orlando]

Thanks everyone,

I will crack this, everything was sanitised as follows:

the FV was filled with warm water and cleaned with OXI, the lid, airlock, bung, spoon and everything was put inside and left to soak. then tipped away, rinsed with the shower and then soaked with a little bleach for about 30mins. tipped away, rinsed. the thermometer, tin opener and scissors were cleaned and kept in boiling water.

This time I just used tap water, used the kettle to boil a litre and a half, poured that in the FV, added the wort and sugar, stirred and added the cold water. took the sample for the OG with a sanitised turkey baster which went down the sink.

the only thing I can think of is the thermometer is a digital food thermometer which i cannot fully submerse. inbetween readings it was kept in the boiled water as deep as possible.

Chemsan arrived today so next time will also have a spray to hand.

Cleaned the FV with OXI last night but it still smells a bit from the brew so will give that a dose of bleach soon (4ml/litre).

Meantime heres the photos from last night (if I've worked out how to post them lol).

Thankyou all for your support
beerbot.JPGbeerfv.JPG

That second picture doesn't look like an infection. However, your nose is better at detection than my eyes.

Boiled water isn't sterile, it won't kill spores. That's why autoclaves and in our case pressure cookers are used when handling yeast in very small quantities. You need heat above boiling at circa 15 psi for 20 minutes to achieve sterility. The Chemsan I assume is a no rinse sanitiser, I use Starsan. If I'm right this is going to be your best friend in getting back on track and staying on track once your deep bleach clean has succeeded.

[Nitro Jim]

Thanks everyone,

I will crack this, everything was sanitised as follows:

the FV was filled with warm water and cleaned with OXI, the lid, airlock, bung, spoon and everything was put inside and left to soak. then tipped away, rinsed with the shower and then soaked with a little bleach for about 30mins. tipped away, rinsed. the thermometer, tin opener and scissors were cleaned and kept in boiling water.

This time I just used tap water, used the kettle to boil a litre and a half, poured that in the FV, added the wort and sugar, stirred and added the cold water. took the sample for the OG with a sanitised turkey baster which went down the sink.

the only thing I can think of is the thermometer is a digital food thermometer which i cannot fully submerse. inbetween readings it was kept in the boiled water as deep as possible.

Chemsan arrived today so next time will also have a spray to hand.

Cleaned the FV with OXI last night but it still smells a bit from the brew so will give that a dose of bleach soon (4ml/litre).

Meantime heres the photos from last night (if I've worked out how to post them lol).

Thankyou all for your support
beerbot.JPGbeerfv.JPG

See the bits I have made bold, this may be your problem...

A no rinse sanitiser may help your problem disappear.

[Kingfisher4]

Agree with all of the above helpful advice. I suspect the no rinse sanitiser will be a game changer for you.

If the chemsan is like starsan, it relies on maintaining its level of acidity to work. My tapwater turns Starsan cloudy and reduces its efficacy. I make up a small 500ml spray bottle (from a Garden centre or pound shop) with appropriate dilution and keep it to hand. I keep my thermometer and hydrometer in an appropriate sized RUB (really useful box) in the same solution.

I would also suggest that you fill the bottles fuller than your picture, reduces the chance of oxidation spoiling your cherished beer, when made.

[orlando]

I would also suggest that you fill the bottles fuller than your picture, reduces the chance of oxidation spoiling your cherished beer, when made.

Good point. A bottling wand is what you need for that.

[clarets7]

Agree with Nitro Jim, final rinse with a shower is not a good idea, shower heads are notorious for harbouring all sorts of things. My final rinse is always a no rinse sanitiser or water with a Campden tablet dissolved in it.

[sparkybrew]

So much great advice, thankyou

Chemsan is similar to starsan, a no rinse foaming sanitiser, 10ml per 5L. I couldn't get hold of starsan but a few online homebrew shops offer this as an alternative. I just read the instructions, it also says that if the solution is cloudy the pH of your tap water isn't at the correct level and to use bottled water - I'm hoping this will eliminate any questionable stray bacteria with a spray as suggested.

The shower , never gave that a thought, good call. Very handy for the initial clean but from now on thats it, once sanitised leave it.

I forgot to mention that I did use a crushed campden tablet after I rinsed after the bleach but | rinsed again......... with the shower . It seems I've gone about this the hard way, unwittingly undoing the good work of sanitising everything.

A bottling wand will be my next purchase to make things a little easier. I did add an extra foot of syphon tube after the syphon tap so the tube was on the bottom of the bottle but as you've all spotted I found it difficult to control the fill level.

As for the existing bottled brew, it has started to clear well. I will be moving them into a cooler place later. I've come this far may as well see how it turns out.

It's a learing curve, the mistakes are frustrating but I'm learning, thankyou all for your advice, help and patience.